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My resignation letter

April 5, 2010

March 15, 2010

Dear Elder Caviness,

It is with careful consideration that I submit my letter of resignation as Interim Pastor/Associate Pastor in the Southern California Conference of Seventh-day Adventists, effective March 31, 2010.

Though I’ve witnessed and experienced my share of challenges with leadership, I assure you that this decision is not the result of any disagreement or ill treatment from the membership or the leadership. My reason for resigning is simply this: God is calling me to preach and teach the unadulterated Gospel found solely in Scripture rather than the Gospel, plus Ellen G. White and the SDA doctrines (in effect, what Galatians 1 calls “another gospel”).

I can no longer agree to preach or teach the doctrines of the Seventh-day Adventist Church or, through my silence, imply that I agree with them. But allow me to be plain and specific. Because I have been a student of the Word and been sensitive to the Lord’s leading and teaching, I no longer believe that Scripture supports:

• The Mission of the Church (3 Angels’ Messages)
• The SDA Church is the remnant church (Fundamental Belief #13)
• Investigative Judgment/Pre-Advent Judgment (Fundamental Belief #24)
• Ellen G. White is a messenger of God (Fundamental Belief #18)
• Sabbath is the seal of God
• The Great Controversy worldview (Fundamental Belief #8)

Although not exhaustive, the above list represents ample reasons for me to tender my resignation. I will minister with integrity. I trust that my work performance and Christian leadership has been indicative of the work that the Holy Spirit has birthed in my life. I hope you will not ask me to defend my decision to follow Jesus Christ (and Him alone) and trust Him completely to be the Way, the Truth and the Life.

I have appreciated my time spent ministering in this conference and thank you for the trust you’ve placed in my leadership these last three years. You can count on my full cooperation to ensure a smooth transition.

For His Glory,

Pastor Benjamin T. McPhaull

cc:
Elder Adolphus Garnett
GLAR Region Director

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209 comments

  1. Amen, brother! May God bless you and your continued walk with our Saviour throughout the rest of your lifetime. God is good, and He will be faithful to finish the good work he has started in you! Know that you are never alone.

    You’re in my prayers.

    With love,
    your sister in Christ
    Deb (also a former SDA who has been freed from bondage by the beautiful free gift of God – faith in His grace alone!)


    • Hi brother, I rejoice with you that you are out of Seventh-day Adventism. I became a Seventh-day Adventist when I was 16 (from a Chinese Taoist family in Singapore)and the good LORD led me out of the SDA church when I was 20. I am ever grateful to my PapaGod for speaking to me and getting me out of the SDA church when I was still young and innocent. I praise God I am enjoying my relationship with Him and living my life by faith in Him. I rejoice that I can also live supernaturally naturally. Praise the LORD! God is always good! Jesus my beloved Savior be blessed and exalted!


    • Sisters and brothers in Christ I send you my greetings from New Zealand. far away, in the South Pacific Ocean,

      First, let me say that I am not and never have been , a SDA, but I have watched 3ABN programmes when they appear on tv here ( mostly in the middle of the night and only on our local, Hawke’s Bay channel) Very smooth presentations . So I decided to investigate SDA further and tonight I ended up here…guided by the hand or God? Maybe, or for sure!
      I was born and raised an Anglican( I am now a very vigorous, energetic 70 years and I LOVE life. Further more I KNOW God loves me and has planned my path through this life for me so I leave myself in His hands to guide me in the way he would have me go. Good times and ‘bad’ are all learning experiences that shape our character. GOD puts good and bad happenings in front of us in order that, hopefully, we learn from them.
      We can find the answers to all problems in our lives quite simply, by GIVING THEM TO GOD, knowing that, by trusting Him 100%, He will give us the answers HE thinks we need however comfortable or uncomfortable they may see. Also, don’t forget…WWJD?
      As I was saying, born and raised and Anglican…I cannot say that I have left the Church, I just do not attend services anymore, unless the Spirit guides me to go for whatever reason. The local vicar got right up my nose, when at one of his sermons( always 10 minutes max!!)he scathingly called Anglicans who rarely attend services, NOMINAL CHRISTIANS !! At that time I had been in church every Sunday and other times as well. I knew that that just wasn’t right. So, in principle, I stopped going. I read my Bible every day and my husband I live our lives according to the messages of Jesus, using the Bible as our guidelines for everyday living.
      The main thrust, at least in the local Anglican Church appears to be raking in more and more money to maintain an elaborate(but lovely) old church, where the average congregation is about 50 people unless a special occasion and where there is a thinly veiled half-hearted attempt to to bring new people in church ( to contribute yet more money!)

      My idea is Jesus must have preached outside in all weathers come rain or shine, so why do we need church buidings now? In Ukraine, in Eastern Europe, the Ukrainian Orthodox churches are packed to over -flowing every Sunday, with very, very many listening outside to loudspeakers. Come RAIN, SNOW or shine !! When it rains they get wet but they still go.

      As far as my investigations into SDA go, I thank God that He led me right to here. Praise God. And God bless you all.

      Live in the Light of Christ.

      Agape,

      Jackie

      P.S. Please remember us in your prayers as we will you.


    • Congratulations my brother in Christ. I to have been freed by the word of God. I hope that many other can come see that theteachings of the adventist church is not correct. I just hope that when they do come to realize the truth is not to late.


    • sorry to hear the Satan can play around with God’s children like he has done with you.Honest answer, you are lost but salvation is for the chosen few, you receive it or reject it.


      • Romans 6:14 Is that it not exciting!


      • Hi Lumbe,

        Who is the chosen few, only those in the SDA?
        Did you know that there are 7 “Christian” churches that is being supported financially by satanism?
        Which churches preach that “hell” is not an eternal torment, denying Revelation 20:10? Which churches believe you can pray for the dead and that their apostles have the keys to open the gates of hell(Hades)? Which churches believe Jesus was an angel? Which church regards God as Vader and Mother as well as the belief in the rejection of substitutionary atonement and of Hell as a place of eternal punishment? Which churches is founded on the messages of angels?

        I believe most people will agree with me that angels are messengers, but is it not strange that each of these angels gave different messages? Who does these angels serve, a liar? Will an angel of God tell lies? Will fallen angels of Satan tell lies? It boggles my mind when I cannot understand why people do not see that they are deceived? There is only one Truth, not many….and to base a religion on what an angel reveals is scary if the message is not always the same coming from God!

        If your Bible does not have act 8:37 and you were Baptized as a baby, you are most probably being deceived by the church leaders in some way or manner. This is just for those who truly love the Lord and want to follow His teachings!

        Shalom


      • S. Lumbe,

        Who gives you permission to judge your brother? When James was speaking to the Jewish Christians in James 4:11, he said, “…Anyone who speaks against his brother or judges him, speaks against the law and judges it. When you judge the law, you are not keeping it,but sitting in judgment on it.”

        Jesus summarized the law as love for God and neighbor (Matthew 22:37-40), and Paul said that love demonstrated toward a neighbor would fully satisfy the law (Romans 13:6-10). When we fail to love, we are actually breaking God’s law. Examine your attitude and actions toward others. Do you build people up or tear them down? When you’re ready to criticize someone, remember God’s law of love and say something good instead. Saying something beneficial to others will cure you of finding fault and increase your ability to obey God’s law of love.
        —Life Application Bible Notes

        It ceases to amaze me that most Adventists in my circle of contact are so arrogant, proud and resistant to truth. The have ‘their’ truth tied up in a neat little package with artificial wrappings and they hold onto it for dear life, condemning everyone who sees differently. They proudly proclaim ‘we’ve got the truth’ and they are not open to what the Bible really says.

        The Bible also says in Prov. 8:13 that God hates pride and arrogance. Since you are being judgmental, arrogant and proud (so unlike the Saviour we serve), how would you like to be judged as lost?

        Following is a poem I’d like to share with you entitled, High and Lifted Up. I think you will get the point.

        When you stop and take inventory
        Of your life and its successes;
        When you have everything you need
        With few worries and stresses;
        When you have an arrogant strut
        Tilting your head towards the clouds
        Saying, “I did this’ in your heart
        And feeling all pompous and proud.

        Just know it isn’t your smarts
        Why life is good for you.
        It is God and God alone
        Sharing His bounty with you.
        So when pride rears its ugly head
        And make you act like you’re high-class
        Remember that King Nebuchadnezzar
        Had to leave his throne to eat grass.

        © 2007 Patricia Jackson Allen

        May God bless you with lots of love and caring for others. Most sincerely,

        Patricia Allen


  2. 1. thank you for sharing this
    2. great decision by following the spirit
    3. sda – in general – should come out of the shell/isolation of those
    unsupported list of above


  3. Wow, amazing. Ben, will be praying for you, this is a huge step. God Bless


  4. Dear Ben,
    As a former Denominational employee I know that your decision was not an easy one. While others may presume that you are “falling”, I recognize that your decision is actually reflective of integrity and growth.

    I am very interested in points of contention that you listed, and the perspectives that you are developing regarding those points. Perhaps we can communicate further about this.

    Either way, godspeed to you…

    ~ Bill Taliaferro


  5. Dear Pastor McPhaull,

    Thank you for sharing your resignation letter and for your transparency! I trust you know that I’ve been blessed by your ministry, enjoyed your friendship & will continue to pray for you and your family. I miss you, Delina & the kids but trust you’ve made the decision best for you at this time. May God continue to bless you.

    Sincerely and In His Love, Catherine


  6. I believe that God wants His people to unite and doctrines of man in Christian churches are keeping the brothers apart and so satan is managing to keep God’s Kingdom on earth not as strong as it should be. We are all royalty, but the difference is that many of us is captive, so we must base our lives and churches only on God’s Word, that will unite the Kingdom! We(Believers) all are members of one church and that is the Church of Christ! Jesus is the only Way, the Truth and the Life, the Door to the Father, without Him we will perish! At an age of 14 I felt the love of Jesus enter me when I called on His name! I will never deny Him, for without Him I am nothing! Hallelujah! Praise the Lord of lords and the King of kings!
    I am so glad that you have joined us in the Kingdom Ben, God has great plans for you! Amen!


  7. This Brother strongly appears to have never been converted or he was a plant placed among the brethren by the enemy of souls.

    Mrs. White was inspired by the same Holy Spirit as all the other genuine prophets, and who does this hireling think he is to judge her, and the plan of salvation as outlined in the Sanctuary services.
    Not only are you not inspired Sir, and you appear to have been a failure trying to be a pastor. Buddy you can’t give what you don’t have;ponder this thought carefully and prayerfully.


    • Or…..the Holy Spirit led him out of the SDA Church through prayer and Bible study. Tough to wrap your mind around I’m sure…

      Your prophet and the Holy Spirit don’t agree on many fundamentals, so this “hireling” has chosen to follow God and not man, in this case, woman.

      Did you know your prophet and your church teach that the Sabbath is the Seal of God and will be the “test of loyalty” and “dividing wall” between true and false Christians?

      “The enemies of God’s law, from the ministers down to the least among them, have a new conception of truth and duty. Too late they see that the Sabbath of the fourth commandment is the seal of the living God. Too late they see the true nature of their spurious Sabbath and the sandy foundation upon which they have been building. They find that they have been fighting against God.” – Great Controversy p. 640

      In case you’re interested in what Scripture actually calls the Seal of God, consider:

      “And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit.” Ephesians 1:13

      “And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.” Ephesians 4:30

      So, we former SDA’s had a choice. Follow God or follow man. We decided to follow God and left the teachings of man.


    • Wow Miss Shirley, these are strong words you use and without reservations… I do know that they do not reflect love, care, concern and a spirit of humility. How can you be so comfortable saying outright that someone was not converted or was placed as a “plant among the brethren by the enemy…” How can you possibly know this? Why do you respond with such hate?

      It kinda sounds as if you are judging him, and I also know for a fact that the spirit of christ would not utter such words. Maybe YOU should ponder whose spirit you are filled with? AND if you are a seventh day adventist and that is an indication of the mindset of that body of believers… then maybe he did the right thing…


      • I strongly agree Mrs. Griggs and what she has said. Apparently Ms Shirley didn’t do her homework very well. If she were concerned she would have remembered that in 1983 research was done on E.G. White and it was found out undisputedly that Mrs. E. White copied almost 95% of her “writings” from another published source THIS FACT WAS PROVEN BY THE CHURCHES OWN SCHOLARS…. The alleged stand of the church leaders was to let the membership know in steps and till this day the leaders HAVE NOT, that is why God wants us to place our complete trust in him and not man… Sorry to say that man wants to listen to man and not God. This happened in the past and still continues to happen today. Check this out:
        1. http://ellenwhiteexposed.com/rea/letter.htm
        2. http://ellenwhiteexposed.com/rea/letter.gif
        If you’re not familiar with the information you should ask about the John Ankerberg show that aired the church “live” on national television: Check out Youtube link, this was also on Video VHS.
        1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Xf5mkZz3kY

        There is tons of information that the basic church member doesn’t know because they are too lazy to do the research and find that facts… Mind you, many who have found out what was going on and approached the leadership to be accountable have been “kicked out” or ostracized. It is funny that the truth offends especially when money is involved. (laugh) The only denomination that I know truthfully who can say they have made a change is the worldwide church of God that was led by Herbert W. Armstrong. When members noticed that what they were taught and were teaching was faulty they decided to start from scratch…. This time it must be God and God alone:
        1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMGJERAGMT4

        Remember that heaven was not designed for any denomination that calls itself followers of God. Important to note that God chose the children of Israel and HE also let them go…… Heaven was designed for “children of God.” Any church that teaches error in one thing is WRONG IN ALL… “GOD IS NOT A LIAR” For all those who may come across this know that your entire life and salvation rest in the hands of the man who bore the “nail prints” and the weight and sins of the world. Jesus is not fighting to secure your salvation HE already has it. Your duty now is to walk in this knowledge that what Christ has done for you CANNOT be tampered with by anyone and His work is a complete and finished work….. No church, No Pastor, understand NO NO NO NO NO NO ONE, NOTHING can separate you from the love of JESUS…. Be blessed and know that you have been made perfect in Jesus Christ our lord and saviour…

        Love to all ..


    • Miss Shirley, your attitude does not surprise me at all. Many of my SDA friends did the same thing to me a year ago when I took the step to get out of confusion. I can almost feel your hate. But in Jesus name, we are ready to be stoned in the middle of the plaza and we will not raise our hands against nobody. Love one another…

      Jesus is our One and only Teacher, Lord, and Savior.


    • Dear Ben, even is uncommon on this site to express worries I express them: where are you going on? You choose to be free from Jesus as manager(administrator) of life! The disciples take not this courage to left real Jesus even they didn’t agree with Him in all views. I agree with Shirley regarding E.G. White but I did not know Ben to touch a conclusion about his conversion.


    • Hebrews 1:1-
      “In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe.”

      Case closed.


  8. You cannot Deny these TRUTHS; the Holiness of Sabbath, Sister Ellen G White’s writings, And all the Biblically supported Doctrines of the Seventh Day Adventists all these are God’ s will. If you study it carefully you can understand that. Bible clearly says that things like this(Your desicion) would happen in the endtimes it’s not a newthing you may can get good support and followers, you may can many astray from God’s chosen fold but you may have to reap i’ts consequences and no one else but you. You said you were inspitated by the sprit but test the sprit whether it is Holy or Unholy.


    • You cannot Deny these TRUTHS; the Holiness of Sabbath, Sister Ellen G White’s writings, And all the Biblically supported Doctrines of the Seventh Day Adventists all these are God’ s will. If you study it carefully you can understand that. Bible clearly says that things like this(Your desicion) would happen in the endtimes it’s not at all a newthing you may can get good support and followers, you may can make many astray from God’s chosen fold. but you may have to reap i’ts consequences and no one else but you. You said you were inspirated by the SPRIT but test the sprit whether it is Holy or Unholy?


      • Titus,

        Jesus Christ is NOWHERE in your post above. Did you notice that? However Ellen White is. You are defending the Sabbath and Ellen and your doctrines but where is Jesus? Who is your Savior? This is just like the SDA church I’ve visited. There’s no Jesus there either. Just a lot of proud people praising the Sabbath, judging other Christians and sounding like pharisees. (Oh, I’m so glad I’m not like those sinners out there!) Take stock of your life Titus. Stop pointing the finger at others and follow Jesus, not Ellen G White.

        My blessings and best wishes to Pastor Ben. Your courage and enthusiasm for the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ will be a huge blessing to others!


      • Praise God for Jesus( as Perfect Sacrificial Love, Saviour, Creator, King of Kings, Law Giver, Holy and The One that He is Come etc!


      • completation:
        not for a resingation from any of all qualities of Him, please!


    • I have been reading all of these comments regarding this man. First of all I want to tell you that the Lord Jesus dose not have a chosen seck only those that are born again are the only ones that well enter in the kingdon of heaven and those that do the will of there father. Be carefull and please react with the fear of God for all will stand before a holy God and give account. So I encourage one to only follow the teachings of Jesus and we must teach the whole word of God old and new testament.I am also full of the Holy Ghost and fire and and a envangelist of Jesus and remember if man raises you up man will tear you down but if the Lord raises you up won’t no one be able to touch you AMEN! wHOM THE SON SETS FREE IS FREE IN DEED Thank YOU Jesus for showing him the true I say move on in the whole truth God looks at the heart.Jesus is Love, Peace , and Joy in the Holy Ghost. Evangelist Bonnie Conran.


  9. Praise Jesus Reverend! My family and I are praying for and with you! It’s great now to know that the Truth is a Person and not mere “red books”, 3 Angel’s Messages or ultimately a day of worship.

    Let’s thank God for Jesus, the Way to God (John 14:6) and the Holy Ghost, the Seal of God (Ephesians 1:13, 14; 2 Corinthians 3:7-18)

    You’re loved my brother, be encouraged : )


  10. Benjamin,
    You are my Brother! I Love you unconditionally. I’ll pray for You, Delina & the Kids. I hope your transition is smooth and without bumps. I know the Holy Spirit will stay with you and God will keep your Guardian Angels camped around You.
    Call me sometime soon.
    ~Lisa


    • I am a grateful believer in Jesus Christ first and a Seventh-day Adventist, second. I have been a believer for most of my life, a baptized Christian and born again in the Seventh-day Adventist church for about thirty years.
      From my perspective, which may or may not be interesting to any of you and it matters little in the big scheme of things, the pastor who left the church for “the Gospel” claiming that he must follow his integrity, has a completely different experience to my own.
      I love the Adventist church, and believe the same Gospel that he has expressed and others in this blog and their letters.Jesus is All in All.
      I believe that my integrity within the Gospel of God’s Kingdom would have me love my Seventh-day Adventist Christian brothers and sisters, even as Jesus does and even greater love than this, that through Christ we Adventists, those of us of course who are “truly” Gospel believing Christians,(there are some who are not, but Jesus said let the tares and the wheat grow together until the harvest) can through Christ and His supernatural interventions (not EGWhite)love even those who despise and hate us. And there is no greater love than this, that a man should lay down his life for his friends. Jesus did it, once and for all,He calls you His friend. The true scholar and advocate of the sabbath and the Advent of Christ will agree with the Gospel and realize that without Him (Jesus, the Father and the Holy Spirit)we can do absolutely nothing good, and if you claim to be a follower of Jesus, where you are now, in or out of the Seventh-day Adventist church, that is where you need to begin (or renew) your commitment to love God with all your heart and your neighbor as yourself.
      If loving your neighbor means you have to leave him behind you for the calling of God upon your soul, check in very closly with The Lord first and be very sure that it is His voice calling you, wherever,to do whatever and then move ahead in respect of His will and in His strength,the more power to you.
      God can handle it even if you have made a mistake, so long as you remain willing to be led by the Holy Spirit of God and of Jesus. We are called to be taking up our crosses and following Him as living sacrifices for His service.
      Jesus said that you must forsake all to follow Him, and even hate your own life.If your love for a church or a doctrine exceeds your love for God and His calling for your life, are you worthy of Him?
      My calling is to love my brethren, the Adventists, but even more than that,for it is easy to love those who agree with you, my calling is to do as Jesus did in loving those who do not support my cause, or even oppose it. I do support and love my church which makes every effort to share with all men in this world wide denomination the wonderful truths of the Bible and to help others come to know Jesus as Lord and Savior and Friend.
      I believe the Adventists share the Gospel of Jesus and the Truth about God’s love for all mankind, rich or poor, strong or weak, Catholic or Protestant, Jew or Atheist. There are some in our churches who do not know Christ, there are some of our doctrines which seem on the surface not preach the Gospel, admittedly, even in my denomination, when they are not led by the Spirit of God.
      There are many in the world who hate those who are different than they are, because they are afraid of the differences, or incapable of giving away that unconditional love which comes only from the will of God which they do not seem to have working in them, but who am I to judge?. For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever would believe in the Lord Jesus Christ “will” be saved.
      I am saved “in” the Adventist church, not by the church, not by sabbath keeping, or even by the preaching of the Gospel, “I am saved by grace through faith and that is the gift of God lest any man should boast.” OCR


      • Jesus Christ was and is a Seventh-day Adventist. As his custom was he kept the Sabbath holy and an adventist, he said behold I come quickly. Saint Paul kept the Sabbath and looked forward to the advent We which are alive and remain will be caught up. In my reading of the entire Bible and 80% of the writings of Ellen White I find no disharmony. I find that Ellen White uplifts Christ and the Scriptures. She calls her writings the “lesser light”. The bible links GRACE with Sabbath keeping by Jews and Gentiles in Acts 13:43. The GOSPEL is linked to Seventh-day Adventist The doctrine or teaching we can rest with Jesus on the 7th Day He blessed and santified. And advent, the blessed hope in Jesus coming back the second time. Jesus came the first time and died for our sins. The investive judgement is a biblical teaching, taught in the parable of Christ. Where the guests at the wedding are checked Before the event by the one putting on the function. The one without the wedding garment on is speechless and thrown out.Jesus said that He comes with His reward to give to every man according to his works,i.e. prejudgement before He comes. The holy spirit worked with Christ and Paul and I believe with Ellen White.I am perplexed that you think the Holy Spirit is leading you another way! You eternal destiny hangs on your decision! May God direct your steps is my prayer!


  11. Wow! I can feel the love from many of these Adventists! Talking like Jesus…not!


    • Can you tell me which Jesus attitude have we to addopt in the case of Ben?


    • The operative word in your statement is “custom” which in proper context meant based on the passage is “as the custom was” Luke 4:16 [ Jesus Rejected at Nazareth ] So He came to Nazareth, where He had been brought up. And as His custom was, He went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and stood up to read.
      Luke 4:15-17 (in Context) trying to make Jesus on your brand label is not good enough… SDA didn’t even exist in JESUS’ time. Isaiah 55:8
      For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
      Isaiah 55:7-9 (in Context).. So never try to place God into an “us” category…


  12. “There be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.” —Galatians 1:7,8


  13. The attack by those who are still in SDA are not a surprise, for it hurts when you hear that your life might be based on a twisted Truth, the great thing is that every person no matter their pass can still decide to accept the Truth laid forth by our God, Yahweh.Many are deceived and God says many of His people perish , because of a lack of knowledge, but what knowledge is He talking about, well I believe He is talking about the Word, if we know the Word we will not be deceived by others, many of them posing as religious leaders, prophets, teachers, etc. Is it not so that we must searched the Kingdom of God first and all else shall be added on to you, if so, what does His manual say? Can a prophet of God be wrong in their prophecies? No, therefore a false spirit is in control and not the Holy Spirit!
    If the Bible says Jesus is God and another person says that He is an arch angel, deceit is definitely at work! 1 Cor.12:3, “No one speaking by the Spirit of God calls Jesus accursed, and no one can say that Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit.” Since when was an angel a lord? True love is also the Truth and God is love(agape) and just!
    Be blessed in the name of Jesus, our Lord and Savior!


  14. I’m still SDA and I don’t abhor Pastor McPhaull for resigning, and for his reasons for resigning. God leads people to where they should be. I say it often, the SDA church isn’t for everybody and God uses who He wants to use to lead people to salvation. It’s sad to think that there are people walking around thinking that only folks in their denomination will make it to Heaven. So God doesn’t love the Catholic? Baptist? Methodist? Episcopalean? Come on!
    You have to be bold and willing to go where God wants you to go… like Moses and Stephen and Paul and Peter, etc. If God leads you out of your comfort zone and you tell Him no, whoa be unto you!
    I pray that God lead Ben where He needs him to be and I pray that Ben be faithful and follow Him wholeheartedly, studying and praying every step of the way.

    -Mrs. Kelli Collins, daughter of the late Pastor Reginald O. Robinson


  15. I agree God does lead people, especially those who love Him with spirit, soul and body! I understand that the SDA church is not for everyone, but there is one Church that is for everyone and that is the Church of Christ!
    Jesus loves everyone, even the satanist, is it not written “For God so loved the WORLD(everybody), that he gave his only Son(Jesus), that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.”? The question is rather, do you love Jesus?
    It is not people in certain denominations, churches or those doing good deeds that will receive the Gift of Eternal life, but believers in Christ Jesus, the Lord and Savior of this world!

    The Truth will set us free, interesting that Jesus came to set the captives free, for He is the Truth and the way to the Father in Heaven! Hallelujah!

    Peace


    • Amen to Jesus!


  16. Let us not bash one another for our various beliefs. We are all God’s children. Seventh-day Adventist, Methodist, Baptist, whatever. He loves every single one of us and because He does we must love too. We don’t need to fight about what doctrine is right or what doctrine is wrong. Who’s sent by God or who’s sent by devil. This is not our duty. Our duty is to focus on Jesus making sure that we have the closest relationship with Him possible. Next our duty is to love others. No matter where we are in life, where we worship, how we worship, when we worship, what we believe, each one of us will individually have our thoughts; negative thoughts or positive thoughts toward the other that believes different. Let’s pray about it, study God’s word and love instead. Let’s look at everybody through the eyes of Christ.

    On behalf of the Darrett, Garrett, Minor and Johnson family all members of the Valley Crossroads Seventh-day Adventist Church, I want to say that we love Ben McPhaull and will truly miss him. I personally saw the love of Jesus in Him and he continually inspired me.

    Thank you Brother for your consistent kindness toward me and warm welcomes when I was around.

    May God continually bless you and yours always, Denise


  17. I agree, our focus must be on Jesus Christ, what He did for us on the Cross and get born again like in John 3:1-7. No one should go to hell, but many are going to perish in an eternity of damnation, we need to spread the Word so that the captives can be freed!

    Amen!


  18. Hawk, I am with you 100% on “spreading the Word”. But are you referring to, when you say, “so that the captives can be freed!” spreading the loving gospel of Jesus or removing people from a church group? How do you go about that? I am just curious? So you take with you God’s holy word, you pray for the Holy Spirit to speak through you and for the Holy Spirit to touch the person’s heart?
    The Holy Spirit is the One who changes hearts. Right? Not us. Not our job. Our job is to love, share God’s word and not judge.

    There are so many different beliefs out there. And every single one of the individuals in each and every group of believers is loved unconditionally by Jesus. His entire desire is to save each and every one us no matter what we believe or don’t believe. His Spirit speaks to us and leads of continually. And when we sincerely surrender to Him 100% is when we grasp point by point, the truths from His Word. But when we hold animosity and bitterness, or lack of love for our brothers and sisters, I don’t care what church we belong to, we are heading down the wrong road. There are good people in every church. And these are the individuals that when it is all said and done, will meet Jesus in the air when He comes. It has everything to do with the heart of the person. Jesus can work and draw the person with a good and clean heart to Him completely and to the true understanding and interpretation of His Word. But the one that claims Him but is mean, judgmental, bitter, harsh, complaining and battling all the time, He can not. It‘s the ones with the fruits of the spirit of Galatians 5:22 &23 that ultimately will find themselves saved.
    Matthew 7:21 Jesus says “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. We must look at our lives, our passions, our motives and everything we do when it comes to the cause of God. Are we doing the will of His Father?

    This entire dialog has confirmed to me that I need to love others more, stay in God’s word more, not ever just play church, and pray for spiritual guidance 24/7. Because I will not be one who will be forced, taught or drawn to believe anything from anyone who is not praying with me, for me, loving me, and sharing with me God’s word.
    So, what do you mean, by “so the captives can be freed”?


  19. Hi Denise,

    I am referring to sharing the Gospel, not taking people out of a church group. However, I believe that we as followers of Christ must help each other to stay with the True Word of God, for sometimes we are misguided by others we believe are telling the truth , for our knowledge of the Word is not 100%…..God says we must search the Kingdom, but many of us are so entangled in the things of the world causing our time to be robbed from spending with the Lord. That is one of satan’s ways to keep us away from strengthening our relationship with our Lord!
    I believe there will always be different opinions among Christians, but we should never change God’s Word and accept it as the ultimate Truth.
    I do go about the way you suggested, praying to be a means for God to touch other people through the Holy Spirit.
    I know the Word says we should not judge, but does this mean we should not mention something to be wrong according to the Word to inform our remind our brothers and sisters? I would like my family to tell me if I am displeasing to the Lord and it can be supported by His Word. If you truly love another person you would want to warn them that what they are doing is going to cause them hardship, if I should retract knowing that the person is going to be hurt, will I have peace in my heart?(read 1 Cor 6) We know that there are consequences for sin, because we are giving the devil a right to affect our lives and I believe you will agree with me that he is not in the being nice business, but rather enjoys to steal and destroy!
    I also agree with you that there are true people of God in most churches, but you know that it is not good people that goes to Heaven, only believers in Jesus Christ our Savior! It is definitely about the heart, 100%! Whether we can have a clean heart without Jesus I must disagree with you, only after we made the decision to truly make Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior, can we be cleansed with His Blood!

    When we get born again we become a new creature according to the Word, do you believe that you can become a new creature, then “unbecome” a new creature later in life and then decide to become a new creature again and maybe decide to “unbecome” a new creature again? When a tree starts to grow from a seed, can he grow back into the seed? I am very familiar with the Text you mentioned, but you need to see the full picture……there will be people, like pastors that will use the name of Jesus to do healing and cast out demons for example, but they do not have a relationship with the Lord. Therefore people who are “Christians”, but not born again from the Spirit, can use the power of the name of Jesus….

    Like Paul said, those who leave the church was never part of the Church of Christ from the beginning, convertion is done not by the mind only, but with the heart as well, spirit, soul and mind you give to Jesus, that means you are not your own anymore, but a child of God! (1 Cor6:9 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?) The reason why we try to live the way God wants us to is because we love Him! not because we must and we know that giving in to the things of the world(sin) we are giving satan a way to place bondages on us.

    I am very glad that you have decided to pray and ask for the guidance from the Holy Spirit, we need to be more vigilant to make sure that what we believe is accepted in the Word and not just accept another man’s word. According to John Jesus is the Word that became flesh for us, the Truth, the way and the light of this world!

    About setting the captives free…….because what Adam did we as humankind were placed under a curse and he gave our authority over this earth to satan. If you read the part where Jesus went to the dessert and got tempted by satan, he actually states what he was given….Luke 4:[5] The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. [6] And he said to him, “I will give you all their authority and splendor, FOR IT HAS BEEN GIVEN TO ME, and I can give it to anyone I want to.” Who gave it to him? not God, but Adam!
    Jesus came to take back that what was given to satan, we can now through Jesus Christ chose to leave the kingdom of satan/darkness and become citizens of the Kingdom of God(that is the essence of the Good news), therefore satan has no more control over born again Christians, only if we give him some control by being sinful and rebellious…..it does not however mean we lose our Salvation when we sin. Remember, God says I will never leave you or forsake you, so once you become part of His family, it is for eternity! We people cannot fathom the Grace and Mercy of our amazing God! This does not mean we are now in the right group and now we can go ahead with our sinful past life, then our conversion means nothing, God is not a puppet and stands outside of time, He knows our future and our past, I believe He will only right our name in the Book of life if we are truly sincere calling on His name!

    Hope this helps a bit……..

    Jesus loves us all so we should do the same striving to be like Him, for we have the same Agape love in us through the Holy Spirit!

    Peace my friend,

    Hawk


  20. Thank you so much Hawk for the response. Yes, when I referred to “good people in every church”, I was definitely referring to the born again converted. There are people who have sincerely given their whole hearts to Jesus. They are ever learning, ever growing. As they learn more by hearing sermons(that are backed by God’s word) and studying God’s word with sincerity and fervent prayer led by the Holy Spirit, they continue to learn and grow in grace and truth. These are not usually going backwards into error, but forward into more truth. You can easily tell when you meet these good Christians because they are humble, patient, kind, loving and peaceful. Again, they are found in most churches/denominations.

    Just wanted to clarify. I know the other kind of “good people” you were referring to as well. :)

    Well, thanks again. May God bless you continually and always, Denise


  21. You are welcome,

    I would like to mention that I too was growing up attending the church my parents were, but God took me away from where I use to live so that I was forced in a nice way to have a look at other churches, because the church I was use to was not available…. I got to know that not all churches are Spirit filled, but rather more religious, you know, acting and doing what the Bible says, but with still a lot of problems in the congregation. Normally I could not wait for the sermon to be finish so that I could go home, for if I did not sleep I did not got refreshed like it now happens……..especially through the praise and worship which was kept to a minimum in my original church…..since I have started to do research into spiritual warfare and learn who our true adversary is I found that our adversary(satan) infiltrated many of our churches……it was shocking to me and made me decide to only live by the Bible and not any other doctrines! Many churches are focusing on what the people want to hear and not the message the Holy Spirit wants to bring to His people…….it seems like the fear of man has overcome man’s fear of God…..because of that some spiritual leaders have decided to twist the Truth to keep the business healthy(keeping the people in the church)….for example Baptizing….my original church told me that because he placed a few drops of water on me when I was a few months old that I am Baptized and would never need to be Baptized again, this is not in line with God’s Word and it keeps us away from spiritual growth, becoming mature and also it keeps us of being obedient to God’s will for us. I saw symbols in my church which are also used in the occult and when I tried to get more info about it from the church leader he ignored me flat out.

    I know there are many born again Christians in that church, so I would rather not mention it’s name, it is only a pity that those Christians are in many cases kept from enjoying and knowing who they truly are in Christ!

    May you be blessed in Jesus name!

    Ps.Did you know that there are around 38000 Christian sects? Only one doctrine can be correct and that is the Word of God, so to let you think, which way will be the best for satan to deceive people……well I believe the best way is to take the Truth and twist it just enough to cause people to be on the wrong path, look how many twisting is going on in Christianity, its more than any other religion on this earth! Thought provoking is it not, to me it just makes it clear that Christianity is attacked by the forces of darkness more than any other religion, so they do not want us to find the Truth which is the Cross, the fact that Jesus is the Savior and Lord of this world and that through Him the devil has lost his power over us. Jesus is holding the keys of Heaven and hell in His hands! Can wait to join Him! Hallelujah!


  22. Hawk, I appreciate our dialog. It is clear that you love the Word. Many don’t and that is dangerous and we know from what 2 Thes. 2:10-12 says. From God’s word we directed to a mosty beautiful promise which that Jesus is our High Priest and 24 7 he is in heaven hearing and answering our prayers. What a Savior I say.


  23. I have to retrack a comment I made on my first post. I stated “on behalf…” of my family who are all VC SDA members. I must speak only for myself. While I know how my family feels I had no right to speak for them.


  24. I tend to say tooooo much ;) …….I am just passionate about our Lord, I am in such awe when I think about Him.
    Churches need to bring down their walls so that we can stand together as one Church in Christ, just imagine the power that will be released if all the churches come together and pray for the Kingdom of God to come to earth as it is in Heaven and not look to each other thinking they have it right and the other have it all wrong…….Jesus is the prince of peace although He did not bring peace to the earth 2000 years ago, it will however happen when He comes back……
    I thank you for your discussion and I wish you the best!

    Hawk


  25. Hey Hawk, responding to your comment about all the churches coming together….I think they are so different because some say the Old Testament is no more, some take only parts of the Word and then some don’t read the Bible at all but instead meet together weekly as if church is a club.:) I like what 2 Timothy 3:16 says, “ALL scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:” So if all Christians prayerfully read and studied by God’s spirit His whole Word, then everybody would be together :)

    Hey, no matter what. When the end comes, we will all see which was truth and which was not anyway. There’s only one right? And we feel that we are in the right or else we would be somewhere else.

    The way I look at is, there is God, He created the world, He created people, He has a Holy Character, He describes it in the Bible and inspired men to share His Word with His children. He didn’t give many different characters to choose from. There is only one.

    We will all know in the end. Right? This thought is so amazing to me. You?

    By the way, the last post was posted through my phone which explains the yucky typos. Oh well.

    Take care Hawk.


  26. Hi Denise,

    It almost feel we are taking over Ben’s blog…. ;0
    So please Ben, if you feel we are intruding, please let us know.
    To respond to your post Denise, we have a common adversary who are very cunning, the master of confusion and deceit, I believe without him we would have a much clearer understanding of God’s Word, but then again, this is all God’s plan and we do not understand how everything is put together yet. However we know that everything works out for the good if we are a Believer so we need to stay focus on Jesus Christ and so the Truth will be reveal to us in time.
    You mentioned the New and the Old Testament and that people has different opinions to what is more important, well for me both Testaments are the Truth, but there are a difference when it comes to our covenant with God, in the Old the people had to live by the Law, but no one could do it without transgressing, so the outcome of all transgressors is death, God saw that people struggled and so sent His Son Jesus to be the ultimate sacrifice for our sins….we just need to accept Jesus as our Lord and Savior and we will not perish.(John 3:16)

    Romans 5:18 So then as through one transgression(Adam) there resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness(Jesus) there resulted justification of life to all men.

    We are now living under the Grace of God as His people and NO ONE can snatch us out of the Father’s hand! (John 10:28/29, John 6:39, John 6:37

    Please read this and maybe you can understand why some say that we should place more time in the New Testament, for I believe many things changed after Jesus came 2000 years ago…..

    “Jesus spoke of a birth that is a necessity for salvation in John 3. He said, “Ye must be born again.” Of course, this birth is spiritual. It is a result of a true salvation experience. Your physical birth made you the child of your father. Your spiritual birth made you a child of the heavenly Father. You could refuse to claim your earthly father or he could refuse to claim you.

    Yet, the fact remains you are still his child. Nothing you or he could ever do would change that. Consequently, your spiritual birth made you a child of God. Your spiritual birth forever settled your position with God. Sin can break your fellowship, but not your relationship with God. You cannot be unborn again, therefore your spiritual birth secures your position with God.”

    Now the people in the Old Testament did not have these promises, however we can learn a lot about God, because He does not change over time, He stays the same and we will always be able to use the whole Bible to teach and guide us through this life!
    The Whole Bible is the Words of the King of the Universe, so why would anyone want to right off the OT or the NT, His Words are precious!

    There is only one Truth and you are correct we will all know when the day comes, we will then be judged accordingly with eternal consequences. Just that thought should cause people to think how they want to spend eternity!

    Have a great day!

    Hawk


  27. During my last post, it crossed my mind too that you and I were just having our own little dialog on Ben’s blog. Sorry Ben:)

    I’ll close out now. Take care Ben! Take care Hawk! Hawk, if you’d like to talk further, I’m on Facebook or you can email me. romans12denise@yahoo.com Blessings always.

    Last thought for all: Jesus is coming soon. The signs are clear. He loves every single one of us and does not want any one of us to perish. Sincerely and prayerfully seek Him with your whole heart by fervent prayer and indepth Bible study. Love one another. Put aside all animosity. See all through the eyes of Christ.


  28. I am a student of the Word and would be graduating May 2010. My last class which is “World Religion, Cults and Heresies” had me doing some research which brought me to your resignation letter. Pastor you are so right about the scriptures. God is looking for true worshipers, who will worship Him in spirit and truth. I was Catholic and I moved out of that realm for the same reason. When you know the Truth, you cannot remain silent and do on like Business as usual. it will haunt you until you do the right thing. that’s what I went through until I walked away. So be strong and of good courage. You made the right decision. Majority isn’t always right. Sometimes when you sand alone for the right reasons, especially for Jesus you know that God’s hand is in the play. Go Preach or teach the unadulterated word. That’s the mandate asked of God.


  29. Hullo Ben,
    wow!!! reading you letter blessed me. I moved out 7 years ago! and its not been easy with my freinds esp farmily even yesterday They where at my home telling me to come back to the truth! be sure to experience all these in the years to come. Stay strong and follow Jeses;

    praying for you and your farmily.

    Bob E,Muyanja (form Uganda – Africa) with Love.


  30. Those who are intent upon accurate answers will no longer remain in a toxic-faith system. I am most delighted to know that God has called you out of Seventh-day Adventism. Truly, our awesome and sovereign God never goes on a rescue mission that fails. Yes, there is an abundant, wonderful life beyond Adventism.

    A former SDA minister,

    Dennis J. Fischer
    E-mail: dfministries@gmail.com


  31. Hi Ben,

    Every time a worker of the SDA steps out of employment or is kicked out due to personal beliefs in the Bible and the Bible alone, I shed tears of joy. I am third generation SDA with parents who were leaders of the church in the Philippines and I myself a worker of the church for 17 years.

    I know what you and your family have to endure because of your decision, but God’s word and the promptings of the Holy Spirit will make you stand on higher ground and even make fly on the wings of eagles. I will have you in my prayers as often as able.

    In His Spirit
    Sunni


  32. Hi Ben,

    Thank you for being so open with your journey in following the LORD. I am a former SDA myself and know the difficulties accompanied by the blessings of leaving one’s former church and following Christ.

    If you want someone to talk with you can reach me here http://www.youtube.com/JesusIsEnough777 or at the email I posted.

    God bless


  33. I praise God for the courage of Pastor Benjamin to have come out of this sect. I left in 1972 and my lfe has never been the same. Jesus Christ has been more real and closer to me.

    I pray other adventists will see the light of christ and come out of the errors of Ellen G White.

    What a world we live in! There are several of these sects with ardent followers. It will take the Hand of God to set them free from the slavery of their so called enlightened leaders – E. G. White (of SDA),Joseph Smith (of the Mormons),CT Russel (of Jehova Witnesses), WM Branham (of Spoken Word),etc etc etc

    Lord Jesus Come!


    • Am I missing something? Some of these postings state things totally different from what I am used to or have experienced in my walk. It appears as if the SDA church is like some zombie robotic cult following people instead of Christ. All I know is as an SDA, I follow Jesus and Jesus alone. My Bible has clearly given me information on the facts that the Seventh-day is the still the Sabbath and that Jesus is still coming soon (the Advent). And as I long as this is the case I will be a Seventh-day Adventist. He has saved me by His grace and His grace alone. Jesus has changed my life and I follow Him 100%. I was born again in 1997 and have never turned back and I pray to God that I never will. Every thing that I believe is not based upon a church name but instead what the Word (Jesus) says to me.

      Maybe some have had some experiences different from mine. Its unfortunate that this blog is painting the church as a whole in a bad light. There are some very loving Christians in the SDA Church. And there are also some struggling. That goes for every Christian denomination.

      If we love and are Christians, then we wouldn’t speak so hurtfully about fellow Christians and their beliefs. Maybe instead, pray for those who you feel may be in error.


      • Hi Denise,

        I am not sure if you are familiar with the core beliefs of SDA, what you believe might actually be contradictory to what they believe. I agree with you 100% that we are saved by the Grace of God, but there are cases where some of the SDA tries to let people understand that we need to work and earn our Salvation which is not Biblical.
        The other problem is the support and acceptance SDA gives to Ellen White’s “prophecies” and “teachings”. For example: Ellen G. White wrote in Patriarchs and Prophets, page 761, “…He (Jesus) was revealed to them as the Angel of Jehovah, the Captain of the Lord’s Host, Michael the Archangel”. We know by the Word of God that when we test a spirit we will know if it is false when the spirit proclaims that Jesus is something other than God…..you know Jesus is not an angel right?
        I do believe that there are many true Christians in churches who does not utter the inner core beliefs to the public….
        As I said, I too was a true believer in a church that was dead and it made such a big difference in my life when I left to a Bible based church….. you won’t believe how much I grew in the spirit….the biggest difficulty to look around for churches you feel the Spirit wants you to be is the fact that it is always nice to be in the same church as your family. I now have my own family and God is number one, I am taking the responsibility of which Master we are going to serve in my house, so I need to make sure I am not deceived for not only mine, but also my family’s eternal wellbeing….I do believe that the Holy Spirit is not moving in quite a few Christian churches, because of the infiltration of the devil.
        If we see churches as a car we drive to get to our destination, I believe we can agree that some churches has only original parts in the car and other might have cheaper counterfeit ones(no name brands) made by some other sources……..which church would you want to attend, the one uses original parts or ones that is cheaper and made by an other source? Well, in my experience I have come to the conclusion that counterfeit parts is not so reliable and could cause you not to reach our destination. It is a chance we take, therefor we need to make sure if our church’s foundation is based 100% on the doctrine of the Bible. The only way we can see if our church is on the right path/lead by the Holy Spirit is to compare it with the Bible.

        All the best!


  34. Dear brother Ben,

    Back in 1999 I wrote an article identifying the other “gospel” of SDA that you yourself, by the help of the Holy Spirit, have come to recognise so your letter/testimony has come as a real blessing and encouragement to me.

    I’m currently penning a further article in the light of what you have just written and I was wondering if you could perhaps just elaborate a little bit more on the unscriptural nature, as you see it, of Fundamental Belief #8 – ‘The Great Controversy’. I have myself put together some comments on this issue but would welcome very much your own personal input and insight.

    Thank you and every blessing in Christ.


    • I have become very disillusioned with the SDA Church. I have found several errors in Ellen White’s comments and the fact that she expects her books to be studied alongside the Bible; they they carry the same weight as the Bible in the study of God’s word, which, of course, they don’t. The Bible is First, all other books, tracts, writings are secondary in our study.

      If we are truly seeking the truth, the Holy Spirit will reveal it to us. He certainly has on many occasion when reading Ellen White and caused me to question what she has written. I go the church to learn about Jesus Christ, not Ellen White. I worship Jesus Christ, and Him alone.

      I would appreciate reading your article when it is completed. By the way, have you noticed that almost all the SDA books that are written reference only Ellen White in the notes and bibliography? Interesting.

      God Bless you for your courage.


  35. I am very familiar with the core beliefs. I am a part of very large group of Seventh-day Adventist Christians that know that we are saved by grace. Its says so in Ephesians 2:8, 9. I am ever learning, ever growing in His grace day by day. Every SDA church I go to is Bible-based. Steps to Christ written by E.G. White brought me closer to Jesus as well many others even outside the faith. Many preachers outside of the faith preach and teach from some of her writings. Many health professionals practice based on the knowledge they have received from her health books. I think there are great misconceptions, misinterpretations and a lot of unnecessary nit-picking floating around out there.

    For me, I am just going to continue focusing on Jesus, first and foremost, prayerfully study God’s word and sincerely ask Him to lead me in my walk with Him. And if there are any more books out there that will give me enlightenment like “Steps to Christ” did, I will not hesitate to read it too.


  36. I believe we must just be weary of people who wants to change God’s Word…
    http://www.biblebelievers.com/SDA/SDA1.html#1-a

    Ellen seems do say some weird statements……oh wel,

    All the best!


  37. Ben, thank you for posting this. Congratulations, and welcome to the ever-growing community of former SDAs who have placed their faith in Christ alone and left SDA. I am one of those individuals–it’s been approximately one year since I publicly left SDA. I’ve been keeping up with your story through Carolyn Macomber, who is a very dear friend of mine. Just want to affirm to you that you did the right thing! I know I never could hear this too many times during the process of leaving. This decision you made will give others courage to do the same.

    Hang in there, and keep us posted on your incredible journey.

    In Jesus alone,
    Dana


  38. Thanks but I will pass on going to that site. Presidents, celebrities, good people, the prophets of the Bible and last but not least Jesus himself has plenty negative commentary out there.

    All the best to you too, Hawk. Have an awesome day.


  39. Hi,

    That is your prerogative, but I do believe if a person has influence in your life that you should have a look at their fruit, no matter if there are bad ones in between, we are all sinners and cannot say we are more holy than another, but if a person does teach the Truth, the teachings MUST not contradict the Word of God.

    False teachers and prophets we are warned about, we are also informed on how to make sure if someone is a false preacher……

    -Was Adam tempted by the serpent in the Garden of Eden? Ellen says yes? Huh?

    -In 1864 Ellen says that Noah’s ark was shut by an angel, then in 1890 she proclaims it was God alone??

    -DOES THE BLOOD OF CHRIST CANCEL SIN? Now this is Ellen’s answer which she claims she gets from God….”The blood of Christ, while it was to release the repentant sinner from the condemnation of the law, was not to cancel sin…it will stand in the sanctuary until the final atonement.” (Patriarchs and Prophets, p.357). Contradicting God’s Word… (Eph. 1:7, 1 John 1:7, Rom 4:7-8)

    Denise, I thought it might just be worthwhile for you to see a few of these false teachings, you should of course go and do your own research and see if Ellen White listened to God and then try to find out why she contradicted some of His Word?

    I agree with you though, keep yourself focused on Jesus my friend!


  40. I`m so confused, can someone please for the love of God give me some help?
    I`ve been an adventist since birth basically and i always thought that some of the doctrine was to radical, and many times i noticed no love in the pastors, brothers and sisters from the church..
    Please give me some light!


    • Hi BR,

      Do you know that God is Love? Your heart is convicted by the Holy Spirit to lead you to the Truth, these 2 verses (John 3:16, John 14:6) tell us how God loves us all and who the actual Savior of this world is…..we must invite Jesus in our being and accept Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior, that He died and arose after 3 days, then He ascended into Heaven sitting on the right hand of God, we need to ask for forgiveness and walk away of our sinful life, thank you for the Blood which cleanses us of our sin so that we can inherit the Kingdom of God….so at the end of the day it is a loving relationship between you and the Redeemer(Jesus), when people love each other they try to please each other, that is the only way I can see how people can live for eternity…….because we love Jesus we also love our neighbors and enemies, this is why we become humble and minister to all unconditionally. I know it is difficult, but Christians do not become mature immediately when they become born again, we become more and more mature the more we indulge in the Word of God, for faith comes by hearing, hearing the Word of God!

      Jesus is the prince of peace, I sure hope you resolve your confusion! Do not be afraid, listen to your heart and let your hunger lead you to the Truth! Do not just accept the word of man, any man…..rather stay with God’s Word..

      Be blessed in the name of Jesus Christ!


    • Hi BR,
      sacrificial/gospel love is usual for born again christian; doctrines and church has to secure and enforce this kind of love. the real church and real love of God are inseparable but into real church Satan has the greatest interest.
      If you want to find the real church of God study its official doctrine. If you want to find personal God pray and open your heart to God/man that died for you to cross. True rebirth and true doctrine/church are found, finnaly in the same source – God, and are inseparable.


  41. Better to be married to Jesus than to our doctrines. They are not the same. Go with your conscience!


    • If Jesus has no dotrine you are right, If He has you are wrong!


      • There is but one doctrine and that is the Word of God, anything else is man made!

        Jesus is the Word, the link between us and God! No one comes to the Father, but through Jesus Christ!

        Peace


  42. Ben,
    The last few times I saw you, I felt something was on the pike, but had no idea it was this ginormous. Wow! No one can understand how difficult this must have been for your family. Roman 14:5 says “Let each be fully convinced in his own mind.” Your decision definitely has fall-out for the church, but it is your decision. No one else has to live with it. Gen. 31:49 my brother and sister.


  43. am having comfusion.. caused by br Ben.. i wish to speak 2 him though my personal E-mail.. coz i wish to know the truth too. i want 2 reach heaven & the way z truth only.. wwhat can i do to talk to him.. i have many doubts concerning these dominations or chueches that lead us to heaven… plz let me speak to him. if possible let me get his E-mail. mine z bossf2009@yahoo.com. stay blessed


  44. Hi,
    It is not simply/natural to understand inspiration of Bible or EG White. It takes you a full heart for Lord. All the arguments against Bible are logical and rational as you use agains EG White. Why you reject EG White and not the Bible? There are a lot of books written by atheists against christian belivers focused on desturbing/destroying their belief in Bible.


  45. Hi Ben,
    I`m sorry you leave the full gospel(grace/law, forgiveness/justice)for an incomplete one. How it is possibly to be a good/authentic preacher if you make a such opposition between Bible and: three angels message from Revelation 14, sabbath keeper`s remnant church from Revelation 12, the role of the Biblical sabbath it takes in the end of time, the great controversy you can find on the first page of Bible to the end of it as in the all human being from the first day of life to the end of it, the Spirit of Prophecy-the author of the Bibble itself?


  46. Hi Romeo,

    On what grounds do you accuse Ben of leaving the full Gospel? I believe he has decided to accept the new Covenant God set in place(John 3:16) rather than the Law which no one could uphold….there is but only one Savior in this world and that is Jesus Christ, there is nothing you can “do” other than accepting Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior if you want to receive the Gift of eternal…. the whole Bible is the Word of God, for He is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow, therefor we need our “Manual” to get to know God better while on our journey we walk with Him.

    You chose, do you want to live under the “Law”(fear) or “Grace”(Love)……if you believe in Jesus, you must also know that He had sacrificed Himself for ALL your sin so that you by His Blood can be cleansed and enter Heaven.

    About the 3 Angel messages you might want to read this… http://www.nonsda.org/study1.shtml this article includes their sources of information for anyone to do their own research.

    I wish you the best!


  47. Hi Hawk,
    scuse me but, it was a manifest of my sorry not of my acusation. Please let him to explain his decision not you, if he want to do this. Why you ignore my firs text about the inspiration of Bible and EG Ehite? This is my understanding not yours that the full/everlasting gospel involve grace and law too. Grace is everlasting as the law is. Both of them are divine, originated in God and represent characther of God. You make an interesting commentary: ”no one could uphold” the law. This is true if you live without grace or faith. This is true for an unconverted/or for an people that is not born again. If such a people try to keep the law he/she’ll take two possible ways: a good one, the best one to Christ by faith or to dispair. If you live by faith you/Christ in you can fulfill the law as Christ personally fulfill. So, I choose to live by faith identifying myself with Christ in any circumstances as a saved man/as a new creation of God as the following text declares: For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. KJV Ephesians 2:10

    The messages of the three angels from the time they were proclaimed, are permanentely fresh till the end of times. This threefold message for a dying christian/nonchristian world involve the everlasting/true gospel. Why you did not accept this message from God? It is a fault/error to accept the everlasting gospel?


    • Hebrews 10:9-10:
      9 Then he said, “Look, I have come to do your will.” He cancels the first covenant in order to put the second into effect. 10 For God’s will was for us to be made holy by the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ, once for all time.

      Galatians 3:19-22:
      19 Why, then, was the law given? It was given alongside the promise to show people their sins. But the law was designed to last only until the coming of the child who was promised. God gave his law through angels to Moses, who was the mediator between God and the people. 20 Now a mediator is helpful if more than one party must reach an agreement. But God, who is one, did not use a mediator when he gave his promise to Abraham.

      21 Is there a conflict, then, between God’s law and God’s promises?[a] Absolutely not! If the law could give us new life, we could be made right with God by obeying it. 22 But the Scriptures declare that we are all prisoners of sin, so we receive God’s promise of freedom only by believing in Jesus Christ.

      I think these verses do well when speaking of the differences b/w the 1st and second covenants. There two distinct covenants here. One was done away with. That is according to the text.

      In his name,

      BCR


      • my friend,

        your still lost and going to hell because of your unbelief (Galatians 1:7-9). It clearly mentioned in the bible according to Ephesians 2:8-9 (v.8) for by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of youselves: it is the gift of God: (v.9) Not of works, lest any man should boast.
        You may asked, how to be saved and go to heaven? The following are the answer according to the Word of God:
        1. Accept that we are a sinner and we are eternally lost and need a Saviour. Romans 3:10 “As it is written, there is none righteous, no, not one.
        2. Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ that He alone can save you. Acts 16:31 “And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house”. Romans 6:23 “For the wages of sin is death but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord”. Romans 10:13 “For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved”.
        3. Confess and repent of your sins. Luke 13:3 “I tell you, Nay: but except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish”.
        4. Delay not in receiving Jesus Christ into your heart as your Lord and Personal Saviour. II Corinthians 6:2 “For he saith, I have heard thee in the time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation”. Proverbs 27:1 “Boast not thyself of tomorrow; for thou knowest not what a day may bring forth”.
        Hope you are enlighten with the verses from the Scripture. God loves you.

        ronald


  48. Hi,

    I would love for Ben to reply on your statements being a former SDA member.
    If you read some of my posts you would understand that I have no problem with the whole Bible, but I do find in my limited research that “prophetess” White came up with statements which never came to pass or were actually changed after time to be more in line with the Word of God…….which source would you use to place your eternal life on, the (Bible) or (The Bible and contradicting teachings) by EG White?

    About the messages of the three angels, I believe it is definitely the truth, but if you take it out of context it is not! What needs to be shared is that Jesus came to earth to release us of the curse set upon us, because the unfortunate action done by Adam and Eve.

    “And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever believes in Him may have eternal life.”

    What did the people have to do in the wilderness to
    be healed? They only had to look at it, they did not have to do good deeds, say certain things, have different knowledge, had to be in a certain group/church, have a certain holy life, NO!
    All who laid there eyes on the bronze serpent which Moses had to put on the pole were healed, but those who denied that option died, just like those who deny Jesus will surely die! For the wages of sin is death!
    The message of God is under attack, we need to treasure it! We are warned many times that there will be false prophets, teachers, etc and they will deceive the elite! So all I can say is that we need to compare all teachings from others with the Word of God before we accept it!

    May you be blessed in Jesus name, my friend!


    • Hi Hawk,
      I was so blessed reading EG White’Step To Christ. It is the best book I’ve read in righteusness by faith. The title is a picture that represent so fine, exactly and profound the experience that someone can live if he read this book. So, I ask for myself, If a single man is lead to christ trough this book, who are you, and what are you working for, if you promote the opposition against a man/woman that really work for Christ?

      Thank you that you recognize Three Angels Message as biblical. Let this message in it’t context and it will give a new content and look to the christendom. But what you said about the need of people: ~What needs to be shared is that Jesus came to earth to release us of the curse set upon us, because the unfortunate action done by Adam and Eve~ it was done to the cross. Three Angels message is a manifest of the real faith:
      1. Fear GOD –
      2. Give HIM Glory –
      3. HIS judgment is come –
      4. Worship HIM as CREATOR –
      So, this is the paradox: billions of christians need to renew their conception regarding: GOD, how to live for the glory of God, and haow to worship HIM no to themself and to music, pastors etc. This message speak about the great need of the christendom that live in the last time of the history.
      I Like what you wrote about people from the wilderness/Moses/serpent. I know from that story that a lot of people died. Why? Because they didn’t believe or because they didn’t look to the serpent? Even in the example you gave the belive/goodacts are unseparable as in the wholle Bible.
      God bless you!


      • Hi Romeo,

        I just want to say that God works in mysterious ways, there are people in all walks of life and religions that in some or other way comes to Christ through the Holy Spirit who opens our eyes.

        I did not know E. White and I did not read any of her books, but out of many sources it seems as if she was not a real prophetess, for a prophet cannot lie, so if their prophecies does not come to pass she either prophesied out of her own mind and not with the inspiration of God or she is trying to lead God’s people in a wrong path which could cause them to get cold in their relationship with Jesus Christ.

        We are warned about false teachers, prophets, etc. and that we should always compare people’s statements with the Word of God to see if there are any contradictions. Would you want one person to be lead on the wrong path because their understanding and acceptance of E. White(authoritative source of truth according to SDA) is different than yours who made a decision to follow Christ and Christ alone?
        In Ellen White’s own words: “Whatever contradicts God’s word, we may be sure proceeds from Satan.”
        (Patriarchs and Prophets, p. 55)…..does this mean if her statements or prophecies contradicts God’s Word, it is of satan?
        Now please tell me, I have read that according to E White “Those who accept the Saviour, however sincere their conversion, should never be taught to say or feel that they are saved.” (Christ’s Object Lessons, p. 155) now is that correct?
        Now according to the Bible we learn that “These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God: that ye may know that ye have eternal life… 1 John 5:13″
        Which of the two statements must I believe about my Salvation? E. White’s or the Bible’s? Can you see that confusion can easily creep in?

        Well, as I said before I believe it will be must easier for a previous SDA member to show all the contradictions and confusion between some of the teachings of White and the Bible.

        We are people of God’s Kingdom, we need to understand what that means…..we already have citizenships and now we need to bring His Kingdom to earth, that which satan fears most, for when God’s Kingdom comes in it’s totality the kingdom of darkness will be no more! Praise Jesus for coming back and reigning for eternity! When God becomes our Father when we get born again in the Spirit He stays our Father forever, for Jesus died/payed for all our sins, that is our sin we did yesterday, today and our future! This is why we live under Grace, for we will never be perfect while we are on this earth…remember, if there is something you can do to lose your Salvation, then there must be something you can do to earn Salvation and we all know it is impossible to earn Salvation for it is a Gift! So, tell me, does God take back the Gifts He has blessed people with? No, when we receive His Gift of eternal Life(when our names are written in the Book of Life) we will not lose our Gift! When we sin however we are making lives very difficult for ourselves and we are not storing riches in Heaven like we should!

        God Bless you!


  49. I’m proud of you Ben for following your conscience and the clear truth of the gospel of grace in Christ Jesus! As a former SDA pastor who was fired for the sake of the gospel in 1997, I can assure you that there is joy and freedom in Christ beyond compare when you can just call yourself a “Christ-follower” and not have to have the baggage and separatist spirit of ANY denomination. Stay free brother!

    My story: http://claypeck.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/my-journey-out-of-legalism.pdf


    • Amen my friend! We are to be joined as Christ followers and not denominations! That will bring freedom and peace among the body of Christ! Break of the walls and that love prevail!

      Be blessed!


    • Dear Clay,
      I’ve read your testimony and please forgive me but you was a sectarian/extremist adventist not a true adventist. I was not borned in an adventist family but in an orthodox one. After I meet my Saviour in Christ I decided to follow Jesus walking on His steps. So, my life is entire in hapiness.


  50. I rejoice in Pastor McPhaull’s decision to follow the Holy Spirit. During the first Gulf War, while stationed in the Middle East, I started taking distance education classes from Columbia Union College. During my first class I discovered that the Great Controversy strayed mightily from actual biblical teaching. I felt so betrayed and brainwashed by the teachings of the SDA church that I could not set foot in another church for 8 years. Eventually, I began to listen to the Holy Spirit and found my way to a wonderful church and with urging from the Holy Spirit and my pastor I went to the seminary. I now pastor a small church in Maine and am blessed every day. The ironic thing to all this is that a splinter group from the local SDA church rents our church on Saturdays. I love God’s sense of humor.


    • Hi Bill,
      I’m so curious in what aspect the Great Controversy strayed mightily from actual biblical teaching? Do you study GC for yourself or you study it because of the school program?
      Please be kind with EG.White. She was not a scholar growing up a specialised church system/doctrine/ in order to transform people in monsters. She missed the school when she was very young.
      EG White has little education but influenced education system. God’s ideea regarding education, society, health was transmited trough a weak and uneducated vessel in a world that reject her with authority of the scientists of that times. But truth is a winner by itself so, I’m happy reading Great Controversy to see that ecumenism prophecied by her is a realty, that the power of papacy is growing, that great utopies will fall, that great crises will not convince people to become moral but corrupt more and more society till to the end of times. So, I respect Ellen G. White because of the blessings she spread for humanity from God even she was a humble instrument in the hands of God.


  51. Similarly to BRs observations however down the track a little, I too was brought up as a SDA but as an adult did not strictly follow its teachings.

    Many years later, following the birth of my 2 children I became a born again christian and felt that I was impressed by the Holy Spirit to change my life according to his word. I have searched so many churches but for now in my area I can only see the SDA with clear bible teachings. Having said this though I have always had some difficulty with Ellen’s teachings but what I find is that the majority (if not all) of our study has always revolved aroung the bible and our church is filled with loving good people.

    I still feel there is an importance of the sabbath day – I didn’t read from anyone’s responses who left SDA church whether this is the case for them. Why I say this is because well before the law (at creation) God santified the seventh day therefore it was his purpose (even before sin) for us to rest and keep it holy. So if you are still following me, I can’t get over this part and would like to know what others (both SDA or other) think??

    In some ways I have accepted (similar to other’s comments) that there may be various churches and paths for various people because look at all the comments and various points of view on this website alone and yet we all believe that we can only be saved by grace through Jesus Christ.

    Thanks and God bless


    • Hi Eva,

      I believe you know that according to John 14:6 there is no doubt through whom we can inherit the Gift of eternal Life, the only way is Jesus Christ right, if a church or a person or any being for that matter changes what the Word of God says about Him we should be not accept their teachings and consider that there is a false spirit at work.

      We all go on a journey in our life which is not the same as any other, but we know Jesus and He helps us to ultimately get saved of our imminent fate, hell. I do not believe that we should join a church who accepts the teaching of the Word of God and the word of humans who contradicts the Word, for the deceit creeps in and we all know who is the master of deceit…. I guess the Holy Spirit will lead us to where He wants us if we give Him total control over our lives.

      There are wonderful people in SDA, I believe like you they also felt convicted to not follow all the teachings of their church, but rather keep with the Bible and to love for Jesus Christ with all of their hearts, wanting to know Him as best they can!

      Who knows, you might be there to help those who struggle in SDA for God’s purpose. He needs us everywhere to shine our light in the darkness so that others can see who they really are.

      About the Sabbath, I do believe God wants us to take one day of the week to rest, but as Jesus did healing on the Sabbath there are also those who work in hospitals and many other emergency services that cannot all say we will not work on the Sabbath according to our belief and expect that it is God’s will? What if God wants us to be like Jesus His Son to serve others on that day, should we deny His request?

      “That is what the true sabbath is, to cease from your own labors, your own efforts, your own activity; to cease from your own works. “Well,” you say, “if I did that I would be nothing but a blob, an immobile inactive piece of flesh.” read the rest here… http://ldolphin.org/sabbathrest.html …Jesus is our Sabbath Rest… We need to believe in Jesus, He has done it all to give us rest!

      Be blessed!


    • Hi Eva,
      for me sabbath day is the first day God gave to humanity in Adam to be kept as holly, true it’a authoritative example and not just as a doctrine! Gen. 2: 2-3


    • Hi Eva,
      (I know this looks long, but should take less than 5 minutes to read)
      My name is Justin. Concerning your question about the Sabbath, this for me also was the only reason before I came out of the SDA church (by the way I was a fourth generation Adventist) that kept me going on Saturdays. Like you, I always had kind of a lump in my throat for EGW and her writings.

      Just to give you a little background on my journey of the last 2 years out of Adventism, about 2 years ago I was laid off. I left my first church with my wife to go to a smaller church about 40 minutes south from us. I just felt that the first church was giving to many positive messages at the time and for lack of a better word, I needed more guidelines. Because at the time, I knew if I had a shadow of a chance to get through the investigative judgment, I would have to bring my life closer to Christ’s perfection. This was further engrained by my pastor that I had in Gainesville FL before I moved to TN. My wife was an atheist when I met her and I had been telling her about Jesus and wanted her to have a relationship with him. Or to at least publicly say that she believes in him, which she did and still does now. Our pastor in FL kept on pushing before he would let us get Baptized that we were not to think of ourselves as saved. I pointed out in the gospels where I thought that true belief in Christ was enough but he wasn’t having it and said a large percentage of even Adventists weren’t going to make it. So I asked him point blank if the SDA church was the one true church and if a large percentage of your own followers weren’t going to make it, why would I even have children if they didn’t stand hardly any chance? His reply was that you just have to trust in God. Well, I was 26, of course he was very studied and I just wanted my wife to get Baptized and begin her closer walk with Christ. So, I just nodded my head and we eventually got Baptized, me for the second time.

      So, back to Tn. We moved to a smaller more conservative church. There was even some Historical Adventists there. After I was laid off, I started to go to bible study on Wed nights. We were starting to read the bible from front to back and any time there was a question, it was almost always answered with “well, Mrs. White says…”. Which I let go and just tried to understand what the pastor was trying to say. It wasn’t until we got to the New Testament that I started to have a lot of questions and I found a number of contradictions with EGW and the bible. Well, we got through the New Testament and I went to my pastor and said that I believe that Paul was saying that it’s justification through faith and grace alone that you are saved. He told me that that was Calvinistic thinking. So I did some research on Calvinism and Armianism. I found that I was totally in the stream of Armianism which is the belief that you have a free will to come to Christ or turn your back on Christ. Even if you were once saved if you turn your back on Christ and lead a deviant lifestyle and know that this is contrary to the way that Christ has set forth for you (example, love your neighbor) that you run a heavy risk of Christ saying that he never knew you. Calvinism is that once you’ve been saved, no matter what you do, you are saved. It also believes that God knows if people are going to hell even before they were born. So, your free will doesn’t have anything to do with it.

      So some months past and I continued to find contradictions with EGW and the gospel such as in The Great Controversy, chapter Facing Life’s Record (pg 187) she says “No value is attached to a mere profession of faith in Christ; only the love which is shown by works is counted genuine” which flies in the face of the Gospels especially Gal 2:16 ‘yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified’ and Eph 2:8-9 ‘For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, that no one should boast.’ So the last time I sat down with my pastor and I pointed these out, he told me that was a ‘once saved always saved’ attitude. I’m sure you’re familiar with the ‘once saved always saved’ saying in the SDA church. So he was really just calling me a Calvinist all over again.

      By this time the Lord convicted my heart that EGW was not to be trusted as a prophet because of the following as Mark Martin points out and you can find on ellenwhiteexposed.com (it’s an x-adventist site): “Ellen White’s prophecies are so inaccurate they are outlandish. There are people on Jupiter or Saturn? Some races of people are a mixture of man and beast? The civil war will be won by the South? Jesus would return in her lifetime? Great Britain will attack the United States during the Civil War? Jerusalem will never be restored? Adventists living in 1856 will be alive to see Jesus return? The tower of Babel was built before the flood? These are just a few of the false prophecies and absurd teachings of Ellen White.” The only thing keeping me in the church at this point was the seventh day.

      So I prayed to the Lord a simple prayer that he would give me eyes to see and ears to hear and show me once and for all if I should stay an SDA and worship on Saturday or not. A few things happened rather quickly. I was reading Rmn 14:5 ‘One man regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Let each man be fully convinced in his own mind.’ Then the second thing I read was Gal 4:9-10 ‘But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how is it that you turn back again to the weak and worthless elemental things, to which you desire to be enslaved all over again? You observe DAYS and months and seasons and years.’ And last, but definitely not least, 2 Cor 3:2-6 where Paul equates the Ten Commandments with the Old Covenant where he says ‘being manifested that you are a letter of Christ, cared for by us, written not with INK, but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of STONE, but on tablets of human hearts.’ Also to add to this, you can find it on exadventist.com that 9 of the 10 Commandments are in the new Testament as sins. The only one that isn’t is the forth commandment. That same day I went on the site formeradventist.com and started to read a few of their stories. It wasn’t people mad at the SDA church, but they were all praising the Lord for his GRACE.

      At one point I fell to my knees and started to weep because my long journey had brought me to the understanding that it’s not a 24 hour period of time that is our rest but Jesus Christ is our rest. He is my Sabbath and trusting in Him and His grace being sufficient. I felt that this filled my heart to overflowing with the Holy Spirit. I never could understand the simple grace that was in his scriptures because of what EGW said that it meant. I was able to break free of the veil of legalism and EGW’s writings on salvation. Now I’m free to worship my Lord and Savior. I choose to do so on Sunday because I do not want to have any part of the Old Covenant that He came to die for. Now I’m going to church to praise the Lord because of His grace and for no other reason. I hope my journey will be at least a little help to you. Your brother in Christ, Justin.


  52. Brother Ben

    The Lord is with you. He will see you through as you continually commit yourself to the plain teaching of His word. Salvation is purely by grace apart from any human effort or virtue and God has graciously opened your eyes so that you would see.

    God Bless you as you walk in God’s favour. Nevermind the criticism and gainsaying of those within the ‘church’ you have separated from. Jesus, the apostles and the other disciples were persecuted for preaching the gospel which was not accepted by the jewish scribes and pharisees (salvation by grace through Christ alone). Ellen. G. White is clearly a false prophet because of the emphasis the SDA places on her on par with or even above the Lord Jesus and the Bible.

    You have done the right thing and i endorse your decision. You are in good company.

    Blessings


  53. With all the talk of Ellen White being a prophetess, someone needs to continually ask the question we ask the Mormons, ‘What is the sign of a true prophet?’ The Bible says they must have 100% accuracy in their prophecies being fulfilled or they are false prophets and should be stoned.

    Deut 13:1-5
    “If a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises among you and gives you a sign or a wonder, 2 and the sign or the wonder comes true, concerning which he spoke to you, saying, ‘Let us go after other gods (whom you have not known) and let us serve them,’ 3 you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams; for the Lord your God is testing you to find out if you love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul. 4 “You shall follow the Lord your God and fear Him; and you shall keep His commandments, listen to His voice, serve Him, and cling to Him. 5 “But that prophet or that dreamer of dreams shall be put to death, because he has counseled rebellion against the Lord your God who brought you from the land of Egypt and redeemed you from the house of slavery, to seduce you from the way in which the Lord your God commanded you to walk. So you shall purge the evil from among you.”NASU

    Since Ellen White had many, many, many more dreams and visions than ANY Bible prophet this test should be carefully placed upon her.

    On the website http://www.exadventist.com [the section 'A True Prophet?] you’ll see just some of the prophecies Ellen White made that did not come true. No one can honestly waltz away from them. I challenge our one brother to check these things out.

    Just one more thing to think about: Ellen White copied from Joseph Smith…hmmm. Have a great weekend! Blessings to you Ben and friends and seekers!


    • Paul quoted pagan writers! Is he not inspired because he qouted from them? Ellen White copied from Paul, Moses and other prophets. Is this a wrong thing?
      You said: The Bible says they must have 100% accuracy in their prophecies being fulfilled or they are false prophets and should be stoned.
      Please apply this to Ionah, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Hosea but please be consecvent with all prophets no just in EG White case. If from this point of view, Ellen White does what Paul does, why do you accept one and reject the other? Are you honest? Or if a prophet is still prophet because of God calling, she need Christ too, like me and you. She was limited as human beeing because of human condition, and because of her weakness, education etc but her ministry and writings talks by themselves about God calling. God bless you?


      • Do you hear what you’re saying? You are tearing down the credibility of the Scriptures to support Ellen White. You’re doing the same thing the Mormons do. Paul didn’t plagiarize and he quotes a line in a sermon. Ellen White’s prophecies are so inaccurate they are outlandish. There are people dressed like pilgrims on Jupiter or Saturn? Some races of people are a mixture of man and beast? The civil war will be won by the South? Jesus would return in her lifetime? Great Britain will attack the United States during the Civil War? Od Jerusalem will never be restored? Adventists living in 1856 will be alive to see Jesus return? The tower of Babel was built before the flood? These are just a few of the false prophecies and absurd teachings of Ellen White.
        Ellen White lied about her plagiarism. What a pitiful view of inspiration you have.


      • Wow Mark,

        I am glad that you can give us some of your knowledge about E. White….maybe Romeo can explain to us how this prophetess can prophecy things that was not the truth? If I am correct, in the days of the prophets, if their prophecy was a lie they were killed, people now give prophecies left right and center and do not take responsibility for it….it could cause a lot of harm to people. If you tell people that Jesus is coming back in their lifetime you must be sure that that is the case, because if it does not happen we will find a great falling away from the Church of Christ, people will say it is a false religion. A Prophet is a messenger of God and God does not lie!

        Thanks


      • Hi Mark,
        I like to discuss EGWhite with people that read it not with intoxicated people, as I like to discuss Bible with people that read and love Bible and His Author. If you are commited to disagree with EG White please oppose her in that aspect:
        ” To love God with all the heart, to be a partaker with Christ in His humiliation and suffering, means more than many understand. The atonement of Christ is the great central truth around which cluster all the truths that pertain to the great work of redemption. The mind of man is to blend with the mind of Christ. This union sanctifies the understanding, giving the thoughts clearness and force. . . . {LHU 229.4}”

        1. What am I saying about EG White/Bible? I know very well what I am saying but some people are in wonder because of their misconceptions. Paul did’t plagiarize!? Sorry for who you because you are desinformed. Please study more Old and New Testament and answer to this question: In what percentage New Testament is formed from Old testament language, expresions without indicate the source? Have prophets author’s rights laws upon their writings? Are they living from books? Or did they wrote books to be protected or to be spread without limit and with no protection! Please let me to consider yourself an example of intoxicated people with preconceived ideeas about EG White because you have an misconception about Bible itself.
        ~It is not simply/natural to understand inspiration of Bible or EG White. It takes you a full heart for Lord. All the arguments against Bible are logical and rational as you use agains EG White. Why you reject EG White and not the Bible? There are a lot of books written by atheists against christian belivers focused on desturbing/destroying their belief in Bible.~
        Which of the prophets did not plagiarize the Holy Spirit? Can a prophet be original? Which is the link/limit between plagiarize and inspiration? For the sake of God ~Do you hear what you’re saying?~ Oh, scuse me, please ask your personal prophet to be original but not to mine. At least, show me a true prophet that pretend originality his writings and I will give him money but not trust.
        It is not a prophet a human beeing that speaks the word coming from God? Is there an inspired prophet that pretend to be himself the source of it’s book?
        Please apply concepts from you world, from XX-century, for carrier writers, to XX-th century’s writers-; please apply economical concept that functions in an capitalist society, to these areas and please do not apply it in religion, in inspiration process, just because you are commited accuse and disagree with EG White. Be yourself honest! Matthew 7:3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

        2. Credibility of Scripture/EGWhite. For me the Sacred Scripture is the Word of God, inspired by God but written by humans. Please, let it be the Word of God even you find in it human errors.
        3. I want to accept your(Hawk) proposal to discuss EGWhite prophecies. So, please give me the book, page, or the whole phrase in which she declares `There are people dressed like pilgrims on Jupiter or Saturn`.
        I think we discuss in the spirit of what Jesus said in KJV John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. – If some of us want to receive it we will see.


  54. Dear ‘bloggers’

    Just as an added thought on this question of ‘The Sabbath’ could I direct you to this link where my brother in Christ, Shaun Willcock, gives details of his book ‘The Sabbath and The Lord’s Day’

    http://www.biblebasedministries.co.uk/

    Cecil Andrews


  55. I’ve read the abstract of the book you direct the bloggers and I hope that it will be biblical. It seem to me that is not biblical because all the bible characthers, without exception, had very accurate practice regarding observance of seventh day of the week as sabbath day. New Testament is very clear saying that it was the custom of Jesus to go to synagogue in Sabbath day(Luke 4: 16), and please keep your mind open, He live as God and as the son of Man(Adam). He live as God(sabath is from God-Gen: 2: 2-3, He invented the sabath day, He gave it to humanity in a sinless world) and He live as Man(obeying God, a beginer of a new humanity that follow Jesus by faith).


  56. I am not sure what you are trying to say mentioning Isaiah, etc., but I really hope you are not trying to put E. White on par with those prophets of God!

    Why SDA uses the Sabbath to build a huge wall around them is not what I see God wants for His people. I believe our bodies has become the Temple of God and that He is always with us. You seem to refer to the OT mostly when it comes to the Sabbath, why do you not refer to how Jesus saw Sabbath? Does it mean if we do not believe like SDA about when Sabbath is to be held that we are doomed? If you can support it with Scripture from the New Covenant, I will really appreciate it!

    Remember that God did not only have one Covenant with man…..right in the beginning incest was not sin, but after the LAW it became a sin….if we want to please God we will obey His Commandments, if we want to make Sunday our Sabbath, because we work Monday to Saturday(like God was busy for 6 days and rested on the 7th), is it wrong?Is the Sabbath not meant to be “a day of rest” or does it mean Saturday is the day of rest??????

    May I ask those in SDA “Is it lawful on the Sabbath to do good or to do harm, to save a life or to kill?”

    Something to think about….Colossians 2:16-17
    16Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the SABBATH days:
    17Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ

    All the best!


    • Hi Hawk,
      I want just remember you that ~it is not simply/natural to understand inspiration of Bible or EG White. It takes you a full heart for Lord. All the arguments against Bible are logical and rational as you use agains EG White. Why you reject EG White and not the Bible? There are a lot of books written by atheists against christian belivers focused on desturbing/destroying their belief in Bible.~

      Regarding Sabbath Day:
      1. Sabbath is not an Old Convenant Institution but it comes from GOD in EDEN – Genesis 2: 2-3. Please read it.
      2. Sabbath is an everlasting institution as the Convenant it belongs to it, and this is the reason because it appears in Old Convenant/or Jew Convenant too. God’s commandmends including Sabbath are moral standards of the characther of God – God kept the very first Sabbath. And God is not like human – becoming more moral, more good or bad.
      3. God gives sabbath day to humanity as a gift of His will regarding the relationship between God and all human beeing, as a promise that He always will be in touch with humans whatever it comes.
      4. Christ was God/human. He lives for all humanity a perfect human/godly life, and this include sabath keeping. He lives as en example for me and you not as an example for jews. Please follow Him even in the observance of the Holly Sabbath.
      5. Regarding what is lawful to do in sabbath, I think is a wrong question. Because I keep the sabbath not because of the law but because of Christ. Please be in a good relation with your Saviour, follow Him in Sabbath day and you will discover what is He doing in Sabbath that day. I think He will be focused on you, on your salvation, on your blessings, on your tears, on your goals, on your love, on your life growing in Him, on your forgiveness etc.
      6. Want you, or can you to please God keeping a day that He didn’t commanded to be kept?
      7. Incest was not sin!? Sin is always sin in the eyes of God. Please be very careful with such arguments. Put this argument away in the sake of God. Please use Romans 5 in order to solve the problem of sin, of its begining related with the everlasting Law of God in the everlasting Convenant. But I understand what you want to mean – Romans 4: 8.

      Regarding Colossian 2, please follow the link.
      http://www.Colossians-2-16.com


      • Hi,

        This discussion does not seem to go anywhere, but anyway, I believe Jesus was accused many times of not respecting the Sabbath like He was suppose to. Was He doomed…… ;( I believe He was not part of the church who kept the Sabbath correctly…..mmmmmm……Sabbath is a day of rest and a day we can praise and worship our God, some do it on Saturday, some on Sunday and some on another, it is still part of most Christians lives.

        Jesus did not come to earth to bring a religion, but rather brought Salvation to the captives and wants to have a relationship with us. Jesus is a King and we are part of His Kingdom…..

        We have to watch out for condemnation and legalism, because there is no way that a person will not transgress the rules of Sabbath at least once like we all transgress the Law……for ex. who has never told a lie or coveted, etc.

        Incest…. if I am wrong, explain to me how God wanted man to procreate without incest(sin)? How did Noah’s family populate the earth?
        Food for thought…Romans 5:13
        13for before the law was given, sin was in the world. But sin is not taken into account when there is no law.
        So incest might have been sin, but was not brought in account because there was no LAW…..therefore God made a Covenant and gave them the Law! God also made a Covenant after the Flood…..Jesus brought the new Covenant.
        Hebrews 8:13 13In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.
        Is it not so that the 10 Commandments are written on our hearts and that we can through the Holy Spirit have the ability to obey God’s Laws, why are so many churches placing the Law outside which places their members under condemnation!

        My brother, be blessed in the name of Jesus!


      • Hi Hawk,
        Please dont’t be angry in arguments, and keep your mind open. So, let’s restart our disscusion:
        1. Sabbath is not an institutuion of the OLD CONVENANT – because sabbath day appears BEFORE the OLD CONVENANT(with Israel). Sabbath day is an institution from EDEN, coming out from inside of GOD(why God gives to the word Sabbat day? Can you explain this. Oh, scuse me, but you are interested in declaring incest not sin, but you run from the importasnce of a institution coming from Eden).
        2. Jesus keept the sabbath day as holly because HE IS LORD OF THE SABATH, HE GIVES TO THE MAN(ADAM), HE BLESSED IT AND MAKE IT HOLLY and fulfill HIMSELF 4-TH comandment, as Cretor in Eden and as Saviour in His earthly life; but , scuse me, in your argumentation, you are interested what the jews tell to Christ about sabbat as interpreters of the law, and you didn’t see what Jesus did in Sabbath; why? Are you interested in Jesus’s creed on sabbath or you are iuntrerested to authorize Jew’s misconceptions about Sabbath and throw down to the sand Jesus Faith/acts about it?
        3. I advertise you to be carefful with such an argument and you insisted. So, let me to give some food for thougth, accompanied by my excuses. ~ Incest was not sin!? Sin is always sin in the eyes of God. Please be very careful with such arguments. Put this argument away in the sake of God. Please use Romans 5 in order to solve the problem of sin, of its begining related with the everlasting Law of God in the everlasting Convenant. ~ ~ I’m glad that you read Romans 4: 8 “Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will never count against him.” and came to the conclusion that Lord will never count this sin against them.
        4. I undestand your reason about Romans 5: 13: But sin is not taken into account when there is no law. But because you want to run away from the everlasting LAW of GOD you misunderstand this verse/principle and apply it wrong. Did Lucifer sinned? What Law did he transgress? Did it’s sin counted by God as sin? Did Cain sinned? What commandment from Law did he transgress?Did it’s sin counted by God as sin? OLD CONVENANT COMES AFTER cca 2500 YEARS OF HISTORY OF SIN(The Exodus was dated by Bishop Ussher as 1446BC, which would make it 1566BC when Moses was born). There were a such multitude OF SINS that God decided to destroy the world. IF THERE IS NO SIN/(OR GOD DID NOT COUNT THE SIN AS SIN) BEFORE MOSES WHY GOD DESTROY THE WORLD TROUGH FLOOD?
        5. PLease show me the outside realty of your inward law, written by God in your heart, as you wrote: ~Is it not so that the 10 Commandments are written on our hearts and that we can through the Holy Spirit have the ability to obey God’s Laws, why are so many churches placing the Law outside which places their members under condemnation! ~ it is an biblical exercise to test your faith as Jacob ask to the so-declared faitfull members of that times.
        God bless you and please be kind with me!


  57. Can someone tell me what would have been the difference between the Sabbath and another day of the week in what Jesus did every day of His ministry.

    I believe Jesus only did good and did not labor as we understood it, therefore He went forth and did healing and teaching on Sabbath like He did every other day….

    I do know that Jesus made a statement on the Cross before He died saying “It is finish” does this mean that whoever makes Jesus his Lord and Savior shares in what has been done on the Cross? If Jesus released us of slavery, does that mean He is the Sabbath, we now can rest knowing that “It is done” and not think that doing something other than believing in Him alone will secure us a place in Heaven?

    By placing so much focus on the Sabbath we are taking the focus away from Jesus who is the only way to the Father, it is not by how greatly we uphold the Sabbath, because we will always fail in trying to uphold such a law.

    When churches take away their own ideas and doctrines and make the Word of God their only foundation, we will become Christ followers and peace will prevail!

    Be blessed in Jesus name!


    • Yes,
      First, He keeps it as holy! The other days were not kept as holy by HIM.
      Second, He declares HIMSELF AS LORD OF THE HOLY DAY SABBATH!
      Three, in Sabbath day He has the coustom to go in Synagogue, but in the others day not.
      God Bless you!


      • Thanks for your thoughts, I really appreciate the fact that you agree with me that Jesus is the Lord or owner of the Sabbath….He did keep it Holy, but if you think about it, Jesus was God and did not sin(so He was Holy all the time)……He went to synagogues yes, because the Jews came together at the synagogues on the Sabbath, does it not make sense Jesus would be where He can teach people?
        Peace ;)


      • I said: He keeps this day as holy and we not discuss about the holiness of Christ! He is holy as God and as man too. As God by His nature, as Man by His faith/will/facts of obedience before God. So, If He was Son of Man and He was, he has to observe the sabbath day as holy(separate from common, made distinct by the will of God, dedicated to God).
        When Jesus declares Himself LORD of Sabbat He referes to the creation/or eternity. If He is the Lord of this Day, if you take away from Him this day, or make it common, or declare it a nonsense you destroy His property, or His status regarding this subject. See where is the great perril?
        Jesus going to synagogue in Sabbath: Jesus live on earth as Son of Man and Son of God for whole world/times/nations not for JEWS. He lives a perfect life as an example for every individual. He showed to humanity how all people have to live in a full love of GOD.
        God kept the very first Sabbath on earth, and gave it to humanity trough ADAM to be kept by every pure man on earth. Jesus kept the Sabbath day on earth discovering the real characther of the real God trough even this fact. He has the authority to correct the humans interpretations and misunderstandings of jews related with Sabbath Day.
        Or, othervise, He lives wholle week including Sabbath day for Jews, and just 6 days as an example for gentiles. I didn’t agreee with this last ideea, because in christ are not gentiles and jews, but in Him we are all united.
        Yes, Jesus goes in Synagogue because of the people. But the people are everywhere in Sabbath day as in other days too. He choose to go in synagogue from most higher reasons: He fulfill the law that He Himself has given to humanity. He is the One Who Give the law and all His live on earth He fulfill the law. It was the custom of pharisees to give laws that they never fulfilled. Jesus cannot be accused by phariseism didn’t it?


    • Jesus/cross/it is done
      Jesus died on the cross to forgive our sins, to give us power of love that born us again, and made us new childs of God(He give us the power of Holy Spirit to live as Jesus). But why Jesus lived more thatn 30 years on earth? What are you doing with words: Follow ME. If you believe Him did you follow Him or it’s enough for you that He died for you? Please, organize you thinking:
      1. In order to be saved: Believe in Jesus. He will forgive you, He will transform you in a child of God.
      2. In order to remain in Christ after salvation: continue to belive in Jesus every day, full of Holy Spirit, doig just good things inspired by God, prepared by Himself for that they are in Christ.
      3. What happends if you sin after you received salvation as a believer/follower of Christ? 1John2:1.2;etc
      PLease do not spiritualize whole christian life, or Christ life, because life of Jesus and mine as yours are very real and practical.
      4. So much focus on Sabbath? Here are your words: ~Can someone tell me what would have been the difference between the Sabbath and another day of the week in what Jesus did every day of His ministry. You are against the Sabbath Day as it is and I understand you.~ If I/you write somethig about the Lord of Sabbath Day is that mean that ~we are taking the focus away from Jesus who is the only way to the Father~ or we access the whole image of Jesus?
      5. Regarding you declaration:
      ~we will always fail in trying to uphold such a law~;
      a) An unconverted man live in this tension and has no human solution. This tension lead him to Cross of Christ(forgiveness of sin and power to live the life of Jesus as Jesus Himself lived on earth)
      b)A child of God in whose hearth lives Jesus trough Holy Spirit daily experience the mimnimum godly life in fulfilling the law, but life with God reserve him a most wonderful life. An abundant life with Jesus does not exclude but include the law written in hearth. So, because you pretend that you are a believer, and this declaration comes from you I reject it as false and coming not from the Bible.


      • With most of your statements I agree…….what is interesting is that you believe I lie that people cannot uphold God’s Law……

        Remember now, I was not declaring how God sees us as born again Christians cleansed by the Blood of Jesus…..blameless. I was referring to the carnal man, even Christians with the power of the Holy Spirit in us sin my friend and if you say they do not, then I am shocked that you believe you do not sin anymore! I sure hope your thoughts are holy, because our thoughts is just as good doing it in the flesh for ex. lust!

        Anyway, if you think I am false then so be it, maybe there are others that could also give there opinions.

        All the best!


      • I didn’t say that people of God didn’t sin. The Scripture shows us that they made sin. Sin as act is an acident in their life occuring in a time of weakness or deviation from a loved based relation with God. Law of sin is a permanent state of the human beeing, a permanent source of sin in a permanent fighting with the law of the spirit(inner law written in heart).


      • I didn’t say that you lie in some sttements but you are in eror with some declarations. I did’t know you. So I am not able to express moral jungment about you. But if a declaration coming from you is wrong I recognize it and I tell you as I reason it.
        Scuse me if I was too sharp/accurate and sincere!


  58. Hi Romeo,

    It seems like the reply option is no more so I will reply here…..
    I am not going to discuss the Sabbath with you anymore, I agree to disagree with your ideas according to that. I believe that SDA has made the Sabbath day an idol or a law to let them feel that they are correct, to use that to set them aside of other churches….well I believe Christianity is all about Jesus Christ and what He did at Calvary! Everything else will fall into place if we are focused on the Messiah!

    You did not answer my question how God wanted Adam and Eve or Noah to populate this earth without incest?
    You rather tried to place the focus on something else, like did lucifer sin….I did not judge him but the chances are very good that he knew that what he was trying to do was not in right standing with God!,
    In the case of Cain, yes he knew that murder is wrong, for God told him that they should love one another! If God is King, then whatever He says is law!
    I am not running away from the 10 Commandments, because I know that God is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow, so because i love Him I will try my best to uphold it in my life…..the fact that it is in my heart, I know exactly when I have transgressed the law through the conviction of the Holy Spirit, helping me to repent of my sins.
    However, for a church to condemn his people by using the Law is wrong as well as to believe that they are the true church and that others are wrong in my opinion!

    I do not claim that I am perfect and that i know it all, therefore each person must study the Word to find their own understanding with the guidance of the Counselor.

    Each person has their own view and so I respect it, the last thing I want to do is fight my brother in Christ…..God told me that we are not all at the same level and that sometimes we will not always see eye to eye in the body of Christ, as long as we love Jesus Christ, knowing He is God and our Saviour, He can work with us!

    All the best my friend!


    • Thank you Hawk for your kindly answer and I appreciate it,
      About Sabbath Day as Idol – not the church transform the Sabbath day into an Idol but extremist peoples from the church. It is obvdiously that unconverted people has two option(we are interest in because of the subject) living in the church: to live by good works made by himself without Christ(because human nature requairan psychological satisfaction) or to live by spiritualizing/liberalizing doctrines(to give away with their conscience). But there are a lot of converted, and born again peoples in SDA church that lives an abundant in Christ life. By the way, I know that is npt very important for you, but I feel that you has to know: Ellen G White advertize whole church about this peril: To Keep the law without Christ is phariseism and It is a blindness. She advertise individuals regarding this problem and asked them with a great love to recommit theirself to the Lord Jesus.
      About your declaration: If God is King, then whatever He says is law!- scuse me but this declaration is wrong too. God gave the Law, he named it Law, and ask the people to relate with Law in a proper way. The Law 10 comandements is shortest law as a moral constitution of the universe must be. It is an emanation from the Person of God as Holy as He is, as Right as He is, Complete as He is.
      Regarding incest. Why are you so interested? I feel that there are much more important things to discuss here. Please, understand me, I do not run away from your question because i have an answer for myself. I have to tell you something: your last post contain for the firs time the question. Till now you made some declaration about incest that suggest the ideea of sin in God. Even the way you formulate the question contain this suggestion. Can you put me this question without a such fault suggestion?
      Godly wishes my brother!


  59. Few things I want to address….if a king tells his people that they must love each other, what will the king think when one kills each other…..did they obey him thinking that killing each other is actually loving each other?
    When God told Cain to love his brother it is pretty much what Jesus commanded us to do…. We must love God and our neighbours right?
    About E. White I cannot say that I knew her, all that is left is her fruit and I believe if she was true that a lot more Christian churches would have accepted her teachings.
    With incest I was trying to make a point, if incest was sin in the beginning I have a problem to believe God wanted them to populate with that only option and that is by doing sin…..later God made it so that incest as we know it is wrong…..like Jesus came to save us, because God found that His people cannot obey His Commandments as they should.
    Are we not one family, a tree, therefore we are all sisters and brothers, we all originate from a few people who started to populate this earth. I know you cannot give me an answer to my question without suggesting God wanted us to sin, because you believe incest was sin from the beginning….. Can you at least try and give me another theory on how God wanted people to populate without incest? Thanks!


    • God created the man in His own image. Adam/Eve has even in his hearth love, the truth, holiness. This is the reason of the Sabbath too. God keep it, Adam keep it as holy. Throgh Jesus, beliving in Him God restore His image in every believer. In every hearth of the believer will be love, truth, holiness. In the begining, Cain has a very high knowledge of God because of Adam/Eve, because of the angel from Eden, because of the Eden itself that remain on earth. So, its sin is great.
      About EG White-popularity is not a criteria for truth. Her writings are not accepted? Official, right. Unoficial – there are bilions of catholics, orthodox,protestant peoples that read her books, preach from them, have devotions from these wonderful books. Desire of Ages, is a Majesty book, the most profound book written about the person of Jesus(let me to be rethorical – how can a such legalistic person to write in such a way about Jesus). Please read it and indicate me another book that is richest, profoundest, more complex, more spiritual as this one. I’ll be glad to find one. If I find I will read it for myself, because I need such book no matter who is the author. But why is somebody interested to keep out such a book from the hands of billions? Because she presents Jesus in a wonderfull manner? This is the real reason of because she is discredited and rejected. If you read this book about Jesus you cannot remain the same. You will decide for Jesus forever.
      Incest – ~I know you cannot give me an answer to my question without suggesting God wanted us to sin, because you believe incest was sin from the beginning….. ~ this is your sugestion that God wanted us to sin, and that incest was sin but not accounted as sin(I suggest you by the text from Romans 4: 8 a solution cause you entered in a trap by yourself. As I said to you I have an explanation for myself but I’m not in a hurry to share with you because you can reason for yourself in this matter. I asked you to try to put the question in a way that exclude sin in God. This is the begining of the way of solving problem. I know that is heavy to find a such question but you need it if you want the answer. As suggestion: God made man perfect. How you explain perfect process of procreation in a sinless world. Keep in mind that God commanded to Adam to multiply in a perfect when He was in a perfect sinless world.


  60. Hi Romeo,

    You talk a lot, but do not say much that addresses the issues at hand.
    Why would you keep your explanation for yourself if I am still searching a way to get around the fact that the people had to do incest to populate! Please do not give me long stories, just answer my question….

    Thanks


  61. Hi Romeo,

    I think we must state that SDA is like many other churches who has a lot of good and some doctrines which are not in line with the Word of God…..until now the discussion was unfortunately been focused on the error, but it does not mean that SDA does no good! In fact I believe it has helped many people to come to Christ.
    For me, we as brothers and sisters must help each other to come closer to the Truth and be open for discussion. We do not all have the 100% correct understanding of God’s Word, some have a better understanding of a certain part and by sharing we will become stronger believers, we will know who we are in Christ, know that we are the crown of God’s creation and we are truly His children, what amazing Father(Abba) we have…….!!!! Halleluja!

    Here is an article by Tom Norris that is very thought provoking….http://en.allexperts.com/q/Seventh-Day-Adventists-2318/False-Teachings-Traditional-Adventism.htm Maybe some who has been in SDA will know if this person were stating the truth or not…

    Be blessed in Jesus name!


    • Please, tell me an adventist doctrine that is not biblical – or according with the Word of God?
      About How God intended to multiply human family in a perfect sinless world – please, is in your favor to think more about it and not to receive an answer. Somebody said(If you undersatnd the first 11 chapters of the Bible you understand the divine philosoply for, of life.


  62. Romeo,
    I have nothing but love for you. However, your theology needs a diaper change. Just saying.


    • Hi,
      our theology needs change in order to be…?


  63. Hi Romeo,
    If you do not have an answer to my question, just say so mate! Don’t come with all kinds of useless statements, if you do have an answer, give it, we are all searching for the truth and we are here to help each other! BTW you twisted my question Romeo, I want to know how God intended the first people to populate without incest, where did I talk about a perfect sinless world though?

    Maybe you can explain to us how SDA could prophesy that Jesus was suppose to come in 1844 and it did not come to pass…..would you consider SDA to be the remnant church if they do false prophecies? If the message was from God then I am sure Jesus would have came in 1844, but He did not……so where did this huge influential message come from, changing the whole mindset of those who believed the lie?

    The church then tried to rectify that problem by implicating an “INVESTIGATIVE JUDGMENT” teaching? If this is Biblical I would love to see the support for that doctrine by keeping the Scripture used in context.

    Thanks


    • How SDA could prophesy that Jesus was suppose to come in 1844? I see very clear that somebody gives you some toxines regarding adventists befiefs:
      1. SDA church was organized in 1863.
      2. At the time when the adventists/millerites prophecy that Jesus is come in 1844 there was no church named SDA, no member SDA, no doctrine SDA. Please don’t accuse SDA without solid arguments.
      3. It is wrong to wait Jesus to come today? I pray as apostles: Come again Lord Jesus, come again sooner I can believe!
      4. If a sincere man has no all knowledge, that mean that is no subject for salvation? If after this sincere fault he does, there is no option to be transformed in a child of God. If it is sincere in his false belief, is he a man of God, can be used by God? How about all kind of churches, that are full of sincere people that are trained in false doctrines?
      5. Please judge prophet Jonah with your arguments against that adventists that never BEFORE was SDA!
      6. THE SDA DOCTRINE ABOUT SECOND COMING NEVER INCLUDED A SPECIFIC DAY, YEAR SO AND SO. If you want to know if adventist DOCTRINE is biblical please read the book “SDA believe”, browse http://www.adventist.org/beliefs/index.html.

      Investigative judgement doctrine
      It is well known/obvdiuosly that every juddgment human/divine is based on prevoius acts/deeds. Before a sentence in given the judge shows publicly the reason of its decision.
      First text I’ll give you in this study is Daniel 7: 10 The judgment was set, and the books were opened.
      This text expose:
      The context of JUDGMENT.
      BOOKS used in this context of Judgment etc
      Investigative judgment is involved in all judgment process. God longs to be understood, loved even if He takes the robe of a JUDGE. He doesn’t takes the authority of divine attributes(all knowledge/just/infailibble) but uses transparency in judgment process of every human beeing. He show to all, the reasons of its decisions that refer to life and death. He uses all deeds, facts that passed, in showing all HIS grace he used in a particular/specific judgment. After all the books/cases are showed all beeings in universe will praise Lord for his grace proven in judgment. In eternity God will be praised by all beeings as right and full of mercy and grace. I will worship Him as a full of love God, baseing my praise upon solid acts fulfilled by God in all human history. I thank God because of this investigative phase of judgment He process. God Bless you!


      • Romeo,
        It’s obvious that you have bought the SDA theology completely and you are committed to it. If you sincerely would like answers to your questions or would really like to know how SDA doctrines are not biblical, I sincerely encourage you to open your Bible and ask the Holy Spirit to lift the veil over your eyes. Read the Word by itself, without commentary and with sincere submission to the Lord’s leading. Commit to doing it for 6 months and then revisit the issues that are listed in the above resignation letter. By having this internet argument, you are just digging your heels in deeper.
        Let’s not pretend that you will be swayed by any intellectual theological argument or presentation of facts. If it is that important that you would take so much time out of your life to write these lengthy posts, then I would encourage you to step back and examine your beliefs, with a sincere heart and an open mind. Maybe you don’t have things all figured out. Maybe what you’ve believed isn’t what the Word teaches. Maybe God is God and does not need vindication! Are you willing to risk, by submitting and studying, that maybe what you’ve believed could be wrong?
        If you are unwilling to see what the Bible says without Ellen White interpreting it for you, then there really is nothing else to discuss. But if you are willing to look at the Bible, the Word of God, and let the Holy Spirit interpret for you, then one day you won’t be so outraged at the issues brought up in this blog. Maybe one day you will instead be outraged that the Adventist church (to borrow the words from seventhdaycult.com) adds to Scripture, subtracts from the atonement, multiplies the requirements of salvation and divides believers.


      • Hi Romeo,
        I actually do believe you love the Lord with all of your heart and soul, but my friend, I felt exactly like you in a Christian church who did not believe in baptism the way the Bible explains…..I was withheld from coming closer to Jesus and in affect made me a passive Christian. All my family is or was in this church as well as many of my friends who are Christians I believe…fortunately slowly but surely my beloveds are seeing the light and can now enjoy the Lord and be obedient because we have that inner love that only the Holy Spirit can give us!
        You won’t believe how my life has changed since I focused on what the Bible says and not what theologians are trying to teach me for the most part, I am now in a church based solely on the Word……humans are lazy, they want other people to do the hard work(study the Bible) so that they can sit back and get spoon fed, I know for I was one of them, until I made a decision that I want to be a doer of the Word and follower of Christ not a church!
        Keep on with your discussions, the Truth will come if that is what you truly desire……just know that I do not reject or hate you for being in SDA, but rather that I love you as I love my self…..I will also want people to help me, therefore I appreciate those who are prepared to have discussions especially based on God’s Word….faith comes by hearing, hearing the Word of God!

        Be blessed!


      • Hi cloudwhatcher,
        I asked Holy Spirit and he is my friend. I continue to call Holy Spirit to be plain in my life. It seems to me that you are asking me what Job’s friends asked him. So, you have a receipt for me. Please, receive one from me with my promise that if you will do the same I will do what you suggest me. Look at my proposal:
        Introduction: I think you are familiar that there were a lot of nonbiblical prophets that were slain by believers in Old Testaments times as in New Testaments times.
        Proposal: please read Step to Christ, by E.G.White not as a book of a prophet but only to see what a ordinary people can write about such a subject. If you find something wrong in it, please throw it away forever. But if this book gives you a call for comitment to God, or lead you to a deeper love for God, praise the Lord. It is a very short book. It takes you some hours. It begins with chapther: God’s love for sinners. So, my proposal it not takes you 6 months. If you accept, I accept 6 months.
        For me God is God. But my God uses prophets. I know this from the Bible.
        You said ~ adventists adds to Scripture, subtracts from the atonement, multiplies the requirements of salvation and divides believers~
        Please show me one thing from:
        the adds, subbstracts, multiplies, divides. It is very ease to condemn, or accuse but please do it with dignity and with solid arguments.


      • Hi Hawk,
        Praise Lord for your experience. I live without God for 17 years but after He met me/I met Him all my life is a flowing experience of God’s life. Before my conversion I was in orthodox church – they did not believe in baptism as the Bible theaches, too.
        It was not an adventist/pastor or a man that I’ve met and he gives me some Bible studies to discover the adventist church or theaching. I thanks God for that. It was God that leaded me in this church that I never known and in our area it does’t exist. God lead all my member family to Him. So, I commited all my life to Jesus as my family does.
        I decided as you does to be a follower of Christ as you decided. But, please let me ask something: Are you embraced in/with Jesus faith-Revelation 14: 12?


      • Without Jesus I am nothing…..


  64. Hi Ben,

    I am not sure if you are familiar with the testimony of pastor David DePinho’s, I believe you will find it quite interesting….. http://www.formeradventist.com/stories/daviddepinho.html It seems he is not bashing SDA, only trying to give an objective view and why he left SDA very reluctantly….

    All the best.


  65. Wow, i read the resignation letter, and i’m surprized.
    I was caught up with the Seventh-day Adventist faith/doctrine these last 5-6yrs, and became a member of the SDA’s 19/12/2009.
    For the last three months now i haven’t been back, even though i love them to bits, but i don’t believe the way that they do, we’re both different.
    I am not about to condemn the SDA’s or any other Christian for teaching/preaching wrongly, because i feel at this time we should always speak the truth in love and not hatred.
    Jesus Christ is the truth, there is no hatred found in Him, only pure light, no darkness.
    And we are called to be in the light, and to flee the darkness, and we are called to have nothing to do with hatred but to speak the truth only in love.
    Through my experiences, i’ve been taught by the Holy Spirit never to have debates because that is Satan’s favorite tool to seperate and divide Christians from Christians.
    We are to flee worthless and useless debates, and stay focussed on our loving Savior Jesus Christ, speaking the truth Jesus in love and not letting hatred take over in worthless debates.


    • I agree with you, good post!


  66. I have been attending a SDA church and like it very much, but I have rejected some of the beliefs and don’t see how I could join, would want to join, or be allowed to join. The SDA people have been very loving to me. My humble suggestion to the SDA church worldwide would be to continue to keep the Sabbath, not for salvation, continue to eat healthy, and believe in Jesus for salvation (past-present-future), but dump Ellen White, the Scapegoat teaching, the Investigative Judgment. May God’s will be done for the SDA. It makes me sad to leave them. I had hope that would be a good church for us. I believe in the 7th day and plant-based diet from Genesis and Jesus, that’s why I came to the SDA. Maybe there’s a 7th day Baptist church somewhere, or a vegan evangelical church?


  67. Jesus fulfilled the law and the Sabbath, as followers we have come into HIS rest by repentance. His blood cleansed us from all sin, and made us free from keeping the law. Jesus did it for us, HE is our Sabbath now, “whom the SON sets free is free indeed”


  68. I am saddened to hear of anyone leaving the Adventist Church. We have a message desparately needed in this world. I know that Christ and His angels have wept over your decision but indeed you are a free moral agent. The holy place experience (the shut door)seems to be so attractive to sinners. Christ is not in the holy place. I prefer by faith to be where he is…The Most Holy Place of the Heavenly Sanctuary.


  69. I believe that whatever church u joined or whatever u believe in, as long u believe there’s God and believe Jesus will come again. U cant just simply criticize or hate others on what they believe in. Though we don’t come from the same church, we believe the same concept; Jesus is real and keep faith.

    This website seems to me to be a site where everyone gather all their hatred and post it here. Saying i’m correct u r wrong and vice versa. So please do think before u say the word ‘love’. No one can judge but God. So love each other. God bless all of u^^.


  70. Ben, I am trying to figure out something, have you left the Sabbath also? I will agree on some things that you are saying, but God gave the sabbath to man to rest and commune with Him and to remember that He is our Creator; which the whole world basically, has forgotten. He told us not to touch His holy things, and the Sabbath is one of them, for the Sabbath is holy. You say that you are following God, So I know that you are following Him all the way. Did you pray. Everyone leaves, maybe God needs people in the church that He can use to awaken the ones who has been blinded by untruth.


    • Hi,

      You say that they are all leaving…..do you know where too? I believe they are joining the one and only true church and that is the Church of Christ.

      We come together at the day of rest, some do it on Saturday others mostly on Sunday…..so the Sabbath has not been removed by Christians in other churches and another misconception I have noticed here is that it almost seems as if some are making the Sabbath a god/idol, making it the alpha and omega….only Jesus is the alpha and the omega! We need to keep our eyes focused on Him and all else will fall into place!

      If you keep the Sabbath the way you think it should be kept you will not enter heaven, only if you have a relationship with Jesus Christ will you inherit the Kingdom of God!
      The problem is we all sin and in the eyes of God sin is sin, therefore we need the Blood of Jesus to wash us clean now and before we enter heaven and see our true (Abba) Father! Hallelujah! Praise the Lord!

      Jesus loves us all so much, we need to let people know that our King is a amazing, wonderful, awesome, powerful and loving Lord who wants to make us part of His family(how great is that!), princes and princesses of the Most High God! We are royalty my friends and we must never forget that, so let us stay humble and minister to all, enemies included and offer them the same opportunity of eternal Life that we were given through Jesus Christ! Love is the key! God is love!
      Have a wonderful day!


  71. My comment has already been submitted. The time is wrong, but the date is right. I typed the reply at 1:10 on that day. May God speak to you clearly, and show you the way. It is too late in the hour to be lead wrong. God said that if it were possible, even the very elect would be deceived.


  72. I agree with you brother, I am sorry you did not get that inspiration earlier, I left them too . It seems E G White is their bible. They are suppose to quote the bible in everything ,but noooooo , she is the bible and that is just wrong . I do not believe in any religion now ,every religion has a little bit of truth in them , even the muslims . So search out the truth in each one of them ,according to the word of God , and please GOD alone. He will direct your path , just allow Him TOTALLY .


    • Hi,

      Your suggestion is to search out the truth out of many religions, how would you know what is the truth?
      To me the Bible is inspired by the Holy Spirit and the Word of God, the ultimate truth…..I compare everything to it to tell me what is the truth and what is not. I do not have to go to other religions to search for the truth if i already have it in my possession.
      If you do seek the truth in many religions the chances of getting deceived by satan is much greater! It is written, faith comes by hearing, hearing the Word of God not false teachings, for the latter will lead you astray from the true path.
      Jesus is the Way, the Truth and the Light of this world! No one comes to the Father God but by Him.

      Peace!


  73. “Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.” Hebrews 13:8
    He is the Way the Truth and Life,whoever meets Him,should make sure he or she does not waste the Opportunity . He is the Prince of Peace
    He is loving and kind.

    To all of you ,who reached your turnnig point , dont look back but move head The JOurney is blessed.
    God bless you.

    ye children of Benjamin, gather yourselves to flee out of the midst of Jerusalem, and blow the trumpet in Tekoa, and set up a sign of fire in Bethhaccerem: for evil appeareth out of the north, and great destruction
    Jer.6:1

    peace be with you all.
    Evang.ALEX MUHOOZI.


  74. I am proud of you for standing up for what you believe in and for allowing God to lead you instead of the organisation.


  75. Ben,

    Praise God for your deliverance in the early years of your ministry. Be assured that God will continue to bless you and give you and your family everything that you need. He is truly faithful.

    I have been delivered for two years. After being an Adventist for over fifty years and working for the church for thirty-seven years, I studied my way out. I even wrote an ebook entitled ‘Out of The House of Bondage’ that I have attempted to share with my Adventist friends. I have a joy, peace, REST and security that alluded me all of my life as an Adventist.

    Once I finally understood the difference between the Old and New Covenants, it clicked. Adventists teach that there is no material difference but there is. The Old Covenant was for the Israelites only. It was a contract between God and the Israelites. Gentiles (us) were separate from Christ, excluded from citizenship in Israel and foreigners to the covenant of the promise, without hope and without God in the world… Eph. 2:12-13 The gospel was extended to us after Christ’s death when He broke down the wall that separated Jews and Gentiles. When the Gentiles became Christians, they were not required to keep the law that Christ fulfilled (the Torah) but His New commandments listed in the New Testament.

    I came to the Adventist church as a young child and matriculated through their schools (also my daughter). I really believed what I was taught because they used Scripture. However, upon studying for myself with the guidance of the Holy Spirit, I discovered that their translation is incorrect and unbiblical. I love knowing that my sins are taken away NOW; I love knowing that I am saved NOW; I love knowing that everyday is His day (Today)and that the 7th day is not His seal nor do I have to keep it to be saved, etc…

    There is so much contradiction in the SDA church and deliberate deception. I am so happy to be FREE of the legalism and I am happy in HIm.

    I wish you and your family the very best. Stay close to Him and you will be fine.

    Most sincerely,

    Patricia Allen


  76. So is this site solely against Seventh day Adventist or does it involve, Catholics, Pentecostal, Baptist, Mormons, Islam, New Age,etc. What is your denomination?

    ANd if I may ask

    1. Did adam and eve keep the sabbath? were they Jews?
    2. Did Jesus keep the sabbath (Luke 4:16)? Is he our example ?

    2.Did the apostoles teach on the Sabbath after Jesus died?
    Acts 17:2. “Paul and his company … went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down.”
    Acts 13:13, 14.
    “And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto the women which resorted thither.”
    Acts 16:13.
    “And he [Paul] reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.” Acts 18:4.
    “And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.” “And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.” Acts 13:42, 44,

    . “And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.” Acts 18:4.

    3. Is there any scripture that mandates Sunday as the new sabbath actually saying we declare Sunday as the new Sabbath??

    4. Did the Apostles met on the first day or teach?

    5. Why didnt they just call the first day the Sabbath or the New Sabbath?

    6. If Sunday is the new Sabbath why Didn’t God Mandate it as the new Sabbath like he did the Original Sabbath?

    7. Am I Saved by Grace alone?
    “For sin [breaking God's law--1 John 3:4] shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? shall we sin [break the law], because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.” Romans 6:14, 15. “Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.” Romans 3:31.


  77. Wow! What a lot of time wasted condemning the Seventh-day church. I am an SDA because I truly believe that the Bible states in Rev. 12:17 “And the dragon was wroth with the woman (the church) and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.” Rev. 19:10 states …..”for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.” Isaiah 8:20 states “To the law and to the testimony; if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.”

    Even though most SDA’s believe that Ellen White was a prophet, we totally
    believe in Romans 1:16 “For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first
    and also to the Greek.” Also Acts 4:12 states “Neither is there salvation in any other; for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.” That means Ellen White and Mark Martin.

    We take the plan of salvation straight from the Bible and you never have to
    open an Ellen White book to be saved by God. God loves all of us for we are
    all His children and it is His will that none should be lost.

    Jesus was rejected by some of His own disciples so let’s remember that when
    we are so quick to judge others. I can’t believe that when our government is
    allowing God to be taken out of everything for which we stand, WE as Christians are condemning each other! Shame on us! May God forgive each
    of us.


    • Hi Doris,

      I believe what is happening here is discussing the Word of God, like so many has done before our time…… Jesus Christ is the only one who can forgive our sins, no bishop, no amount of money, no deeds, nothing else!

      What I am trying to say is that when we discuss the Word we can warn each other of deceit and of false teachings, etc.
      We do not live in damnation, we live in love, love for God and our fellow man. The remnant you are talking about is the Bride of Christ is it not? those who are in love with Jesus Christ, Jesus did not come to start a denomination or a religion, He brought us the Gospel and the Word of God inspired by the Holy Spirit…..when there is contradiction between a teacher and the Word, which one are you going to chose? The other question you must ask yourself is which Covenant(Agreement)of God do you accept, I believe after Jesus the New Covenant is the Truth, Light and Way we will be Saved! Jesus is the Word who became flesh, right? (if not I guess John is a liar)
      I do believe that there are many Spirit filled SDA members who does not accept everything their doctrines teach, for example some of Ms White’s teachings.

      At the end of the day, what does God want in our churches? Does He want us to bring false teachings in our churches, will He bless churches that keep other authors on the same level of importance as His Word? How does the Holy Spirit move in churches who place confusion in the minds of their members……? What kind of spirit will be present if the Holy Spirit pulls back His glory and blessings? My friends, I am so happy that I moved to a church where I can experience the Holy Spirit and have freedom to be obedient to His Word, not be torn between what the church is telling as correct and what the Word says is correct! God wants us to reach maturity in our spirit, but there are institutions that wants us to stay babies and to be afraid to be doers of the Word! Who’s agenda would that be if we know who our true conquered adversary is…….trying to steal, kill and destroy lives!

      We are not judging each other, we are judging their fruit and compare teachings with the Word, I do believe that the Holy Spirit does not tell lies or give false prophecies….well not the Holy Spirit I believe in!

      So these type of discussions can strengthen our faith or weaken it, the latter can be done by condemnation….
      What happened in the US government is shocking, I believe this must be the first president to deny Christianity, but accept the Islam religion……is he a shriner?


  78. Webster describes remnant as “a small surviving group.”Does that sound like
    the beginning of something or what is left? Those people of God who are
    living when Jesus comes will be keeping the commandments of God because
    they love Him. If you are happy with your relationship with God, praise the Lord! Just don’t condemn the rest of us who also have a special relationship with God. Let God do the judging. It sounds to me like some of the comments are coming from people who are insecure.

    Sorry, but you do seem to be a little self-righteous. I serve the same God you do and my church doesn’t tell me who or what to believe.


  79. As a newly baptized, I was so sad that you decided to leave our religion.. Maybe for you its a good decision but to tell you all, this religion really change my life.. It change me for a better christian.. For a better daughter of my mother and father.. Hope you can open your heart and mind.. We are one.. thanks..


  80. Love God, love each other.

    It’s interesting how both sides think the other is deceived and I know that as I write, someone out there will think that I am too, I guess. So let me start with a common point…Jesus…Holy Spirit…are we agreed there? Good. Love others…even believers we deem blind? Just askin’.

    The Holy Spirit will lead us into ALL truth? ok, I believe that too, but I’m also pondering the thought that we may be led through quite a few things before we actually get there, and is it really a destination? I like the way Paul prays that we grow in the knowledge and revelation of Him…to me that implies that TRUTH, like Jesus is constantly being revealed to us, and in us.

    Some things, both biblical thoughts as well as daily life facts that I thought were true I’m finding out that I was either told wrong, or it was misinterpreted to me or by me, however, many things also still stand as true, such as Jesus sacrifice for us. Frustrating as it may be at times I know that it is God’s desire for us to find pleasure not only in truth but also in truth’s journey and unfolding revelation. Even as I’m writing, the thought comes to me that if we are led into all truth you could just as easily say we are led into Jesus, for He says He is the truth. (I won’t be upset if you disagree, that’s ok)

    While we try to convince one another of different things, I’m also remembering how Paul said to avoid endless disputes and arguments over doctrinal things. I think he called it worthless. He also said work out YOUR OWN salvation (to me that sounds like don’t be so caught up in wondering if someone else is doing right or wrong – which would be trying to work out someone else’s stuff, right?)

    So, is Karl (that’s me) an Adventist or not? To some that is very important…to others it is not. If it is important for you to know that…why? Do you want to steer me to that which you believe for certain is truth? If so, why? Would it be out of genuine love, or a belief that your own trip to heaven might be jeopardized if you don’t say something to me? (some may laugh, but I used to believe just that very thing as truth, engraved in me like a template, which I am more confidently discarding, or trying to)

    Do you feel like your salvation is so fragile that it can be lost over the slightest do and don’t of religion? I’m tired of that agony and anxiousness, aren’t you? Wouldn’t a loving Father want you to KNOW that you are safe and secure no matter what, even if you fall down?

    Why is it that most christians read that His will is that ALL men come to repentance and not perish yet still think that most people will go to hell? ..even if you believe you’re in the right denomination with the right “doctrinal truths”. Misinterpretation, maybe?

    So, who wins? Adam? or Christ? Isn’t Jesus obedience and blood at the cross stronger than Adam and his disobedience? Isn’t the gift of grace greater than all “your good”?

    If we unite ourselves in love there is greater harmony in the body of Christ, for Christ is not divided and truths and knowledge will continue to be revealed to, in, and through us.

    If we pray for the Holy Spirit to lead us into more and more truth and not be deceived, (and I’m sure that He will do that), then we also need to be willing to be led out of all that is not. Where the Spirit of the Lord is there is freedom, and liberation from things that oppress, bind and cage you…things that may seem to be your comfort, your template of current beliefs, for that is all you have known, and are hesitant, maybe afraid even to walk out and explore God’s green grass of grace…but that’s where the sun is, where you can stretch your faith legs and leap and bound like a calf out of the stall.

    I shouldn’t mind if my son asks me “why, daddy”? Don’t be afraid to ask God your questions, “why do I believe this?”, or “why do they believe that?” I always try to have an answer for my son…and I’m sure He will have one for you.

    Love to all…and may Christ’s prayer for our oneness continue to manifest. God bless you.
    -Karl Cobos


  81. Dear Ben,
    I have been praying for you since learning of your resignation. I admire your integrity in making your decision rather than pretending to believe what you evidently do not, though I am saddened by your decision itself.

    My prayer is that the peace and joy you seek in Christ will bless you and your family as you move forward in the new life you have chosen.


  82. Amen, Karl. Spoken in the true spirit of Christ. “A new commandment I give you, that you love one another even as I have loved you that you also love one another.” Perfect love casts out fear, and love is the fulfillment of the law. God is love.


  83. Greetigs in Jesus name I am from south Andhra seventh day Adventist church elder for 10 year .I am adding 10 villages for seventh day Adventist from Lutherans and others. I am running orphanage home for 25 children in beginning from our Adventist churches .Now I have 45 children now for feeding I am running this from local funds here and there but here not rising fund properly .So I am searching for sponsor our fellow Adventist from world wide .I have attached some photos with this email.
    This is my mailing address
    Cunduru.Veeraiah /Son of John
    Retur.Post &village ,Kakumanu.[Mandal]
    Guntur. District. Andhra Pradesh. South India .522113.
    About my ministries see this web page -http://returseventhdayadventistchurch.blogspot.com/


  84. We must, as Christians, follow our convictions that the Holy Spirit guides us to. For me, the Word of God is first and foremost my guide of utmost authority. Jesus and His Word is my #1 authority. I had to find out if the denomination (SDA)I was raised in was 100% of the Bible as it claimed, and when I found that it wasn’t as Fundamental Belief #13, 18 and 24 (as been pointed out in his letter), I was convicted that I had to be true to my God, and not the denomination I was raised in. I am not bitter or angry as some SDA claim, I simply cannot belong to a denomination that adds to the Holy Scripture as does the writngs of Ellen White and knowing that she contradicted the Bible and made “I was shown” statements as if they were directly from God when she clearly copied them. It is a decision I had to make to be true to my Maker, the Lord Jesus Christ. So Ben, I commend you on your decision to follow your convictions and proclaiming to stand on the Bible alone and most importantly to stand on Jesus Christ and His saving gospel. God bless you.
    In Jesus Christ,
    Laura


  85. Hi all, I am Louisa from Singapore. I was a SDA before. I am thankful to the LORD that I am no longer a SDA. It is great to be free in Christ. I love Jesus very much and is waiting for His soon 2nd return. Praise the LORD, hallelujah!!!
    His beloved child,
    Louisa


  86. I have read the discussion above, and know how it feels to be on both sides of the debate. I was raised SDA, most of my family and friends were (and are) SDA. I went to college to be an SDA preacher. I have been our of SDA for about 5 years now, and can tell you that the journey out is liberating – but also painful at times. To question your theology, especially when you have been warned by your denomination’s “prophet” of the devastating consequences of doing so, can be scary. There will be those who judge the decisions you make, and let you know you are deceived and going to hell, or that you were never really converted since the only “truth” is SDA truth. You will be leaving behind family and friends, make family reunions awkward, etc…so, to walk away takes courage and conviction.
    For those who are still SDA and reading his letter and the posts which follow, you will see Ben’s decision to leave as a slap in the face, and the questions he raised as some form of attack on the denomination you belong. You will read the comments others are making and it will make you struggle with being defensive. I don’t expect that many will be converted away from their SDA experience and beliefs from this, but for some, it will be an answer to prayer. See, I did not leave SDA because I was unhappy. I left as a result of trying to validate the SDA message from only scripture, and found that it could not be done. When I read Ben’s resignation letter, it rings true to my soul because it is so much of the same issues I struggled with. While in the SDA church, I didn’t see the issues very clearly – now that I am out, it is very easy to see. It really comes down to your personal paradigm – and until there is a shift, it is simply not visible to you. I struggled through Paul’s writings for years because I understood his emphasis on grace, but couldn’t make it all fit with my position on the law. I shoved all those questions under Peter’s statement about Paul’s writings being “hard to understand”. The reason they were “hard” was because I was not aware of the true intent of his pen – a totally new and radical covenant. The questions I struggled with the most were how the law could change if God never changes, and the Sabbath. Then I began to understand that God doesn’t have to “change”, and can “change” His mind or approach any time He wants. I saw God “repent” on more than one occasion in the OT – and destroying His creation with a flood. Did God not know how man would be? Did He change His mind, or was there some other explanation? What I came to understand was that His purpose NEVER changes, but His methods do. This is most readily accepted by all Christians – even SDA – when it comes to the ceremonial aspects of the law. What changed was the means of atonement, but what remained was the purpose of that atonement. So….this leads me to ask. What was the purpose of the law? Let the Bible answer this question for you and it just may clear up a lot of questions.
    I used to see the law as eternal and immutable – now I see it as a tool God used to reign in sin until the “seed” of Abraham could come. Think about this – when Jesus said “the Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath”, what was He really saying? He is telling us that he is superior to it, that it is subject to Him. Let that soak in…..He is Lord over the law. This is not to say that the law is bad – but rather that it is less than Christ. Those who embrace the full meaning of this claim quickly see the radical intent of His statement. When you live by the law, you are subject to that law. When you live by the Spirit, you are subject to that Spirit – and since we know the Spirit is “lord” over law, we will keep the INTENT of the law, without necessarily keeping the LETTER. That was the problem with the law in the first place – it was “weak in the flesh”. That flesh will remain weak, until we are changed. We will not be changed until He breaks the clouds – so we walk by faith, that complete trust that God will do what He said He would do and change us. Until then, we walk by faith. To take your eyes off of Christ and place them on anything else will simply not suffice. Thankd God His plan is better than mine.


    • Very well said, I totally agree! Praise the Lord Jesus Christ!


    • Ken,

      I appreciate and was blessed by your post.


  87. It has been really interesting reading all the postings for and against the SDA Church. It seems that Mr.Hawks has prevailed with the most postings. I have been a SDA member since 1982. I decided to become a member when the Pastor of the Church preached a sermon about the Sabbath. On completion he said: “NOT BECAUSE WE ARE SEVENTH DAY ADVENTISTS WHO BELIEVE IN THE SECOND COMING OF CHRIST, AND KEEP THE SABBATH DAY..IT MEANS THAT WE ARE SAVED. KEEPING THE SABBATH DOES NOT SAVE US. WE ARE SAVED BY GRACE, BY DOING THE WILL OF JESUS CHRIST, WHO GAVE HIS LIFE A LIVING SACRIFICE FOR US”. It was then that I asked to be baptized. There have been many mentions defending the Sabbath, and others condemning it…The Seventh Day Sabbath Rest was blessed by God after Creation, and was “SANCTIFIED”….the Apostles went to the synagogues (/) on the Sabbath, and Christ said this to his disciples when giving them an incite of what to expect at the end of the world: “PRAY THAT YOUR FLIGHT BE NOT ON THE SABBATH, OR DURING THE WINTER”. Would Mr. Hawks be so kind as to tell me of “Sabbath” He was speaking? Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday? …Yours in Christ Herbert.


    • Hi Herbert,

      I do not live under Law as those did in the Old Testament, for if one is to keep the Sabbath day as law then they are under the obligation to also observe the Sabbath year Lev.25:17. “The land is to be tilled for six years and the seventh year is the Sabbath year.” How does SDA obey this part of the Sabbath?

      I am not trying to follow the Lord’s Commandments to be accepted or Saved, but because I am Saved and Love my Lord do I follow His Commandments without thinking of it.

      What did Paul do…1 Cor.9:19-20: “For though I am free from all men, yet I have made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more. And to the Jews I became a Jew, that I might win Jews; to those who are under the law (the Jews), as under the law, that I might win those under the law . To those who are without a law (not being without a law toward god but under the law toward Christ) I might win those who are without law; to the weak I became as weak, that I might win the weak. I have become all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.” This is why Paul was obeying the Sabbath like the Jews did, not that it is what he believes is correct, but rather to become part of them so that he can minister to them the real Truth.

      Everyday is a possibility for us to share the Good News to those who are lost, no matter what day of the week it is, if I make anything, for ex. Sabbath, an obligation, I am putting myself back under the Law, is it not written that “the letter(Law) kills, but the spirit gives life”?

      Therefore my understanding of the Sabbath is a day of worship, praise, fellowship and rest, but it does not mean that I am condemned if I have to work on sabbath, no matter what day of the week it is. I spend everyday with the Lord, not just on the Sabbath or in my case Sundays. Seek the Kingdom of God, focus your life on Jesus accepting Him as your Lord and Savior, then I believe you are on the correct and narrow path to eternal life.

      Here on this blog has been given great wisdom to those who can receive and I truly believe that many of it was lead by the Holy Spirit!

      Be blessed in the name of Yeshua, Jesus Christ!


  88. The Sabbath day has been sanctified by God from the beginning and it will remain that way forever.

    SDAs are wrong about many things and they maybe using the Sabbath as a tool against their members, but the Sabbath itself is still true. I hope you will come to see that.


  89. June 16,2010

    Dear Pastor Benjamin T. McPhaul

    I am sorry that you have chosen to resign from the church that so desperately need your guidance and you input. God has opened your eyes and has given you the gift of wisdom of His perfect Grace. Turning yourself away from the Sabbath is not the way. The Sabbath has been so since the beginning of time. In the beginning God Created the Sabbath. And as it was said in the Gospels “In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God….Through Him all things were made that has been made… John 1:1-5.

    How can you say that you are teaching the unadulterated gospels when you have turned your back on the freedom of the Sabbath that Christ had taught when he picked corn on the Sabbath and he healed the Blind on the Sabbath. Christ himself said that man was not made for the Sabbath but the Sabbath was made for man. The Seventh Day Adventist are just now coming to preaching the gifts of the spirit and how they are used and manifested among Gods people. How can you walk away from a time when they need your insight on How the to Heal the broken hearted and raise the sick. You are supposed to grow and not go backwards. Your list is not a reason to quit the church but a reason to help it grow. Again like in the garden the man (you) blames the women (Ellen G. White) for being lost. There are so many People who say Ellen G. White is a messenger from God. God says put her to the test. Does she go against the Bible in any way? As a Seventh Day Adventist preacher you are taught the works of Ellen G. White, but you are never forced to share her knowledge over the pulpit. You are supposed to be a leader, then lead, don’t follow the majority stand up for Jesus Christ Preach His Gospel. You should be like the man who was possessed of demons, even the demons, cried unto the Lord Jesus “What do you want of Me”

    Cry out to the Lord Jesus Christ and ask Him “What do you want of Me”.
    • Preach the Gospel – Luke 4:18-19
    • Forsake not my Sabbath-Matthew 5:17-19
    • Read Revelations without other commentary
    • Open your eyes to the happenings of your neighborhood and you will see the Great controversy in your own neighborhood.
    Pray that your eye will be opened and your heart strengthen and Wisdom will be poured out upon you so that you will see the real truth of the Gospel.

    Ask and ye shall receive.


    • Hi,

      Is it not peculiar that the duty to keep the Seventh day as Sabbath is not mentioned ONCE in the New Testament like the rest of the 10 Commandments?
      Maybe someone can find a verse in the NT where it says that breaking the Sabbath is a sin?
      If the Sabbath keeping is so important for a disciple of Christ, why was it not mentioned in His sermon on the Mount or in ANY of His teachings?

      Galatians 4:4-5 says that Jesus lived under the Law to redeem us from the Law.

      The Sabbath did not bind Jesus, was He not accused of breaking the Sabbath by the Pharisees? Think about this, if it does not bind Him, are we not “in Christ”? Why would it be any more binding upon us.

      Matt. 12:8
      8 “For the Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath.”
      Jesus Christ is above the Law and we are in Christ! Who wants to live in bondage if our Saviour came to free us of it?

      Galatians 3:17-18 What I mean is this: The law, introduced 430 years later, does not set aside the covenant previously established by God and thus do away with the promise. 18 For if the inheritance depends on the law, then it no longer depends on a promise; but God in his grace gave it to Abraham through a promise.

      At the end of the day we must make a choice, are we Saved by Grace or by upholding the Law(we can’t have a little bit of that and some of that)…….if there is anything we MUST do other than believing and loving Jesus Christ as our Lord and Saviour, we are placing ourselves under the Law and we all know that the Letter kills!

      Peace in Jesus Christ!


      • Dear Claudia,

        I read your response to Pastor Ben’s resignation and I am impressed to respond to one statement you made for clarity. You said, “As a Seventh Day Adventist preacher you are taught the works of Ellen G. White, but you are never forced to share her knowledge over the pulpit.”

        The first thing that came to my mind was the fact that when the SDA church was first organized, they followed the Gospel Order (New Testament) of giving. To make my point, I have to share a little history.

        Initially, Ellen White said the Lord showed her to follow the Gospel Order (the New Testament way) of giving, but in 1876, the conviction came to leading brethren that there were defects especially in the basis on which the tithe was reckoned. The following comes from a special session of the General Conference held early that year:

        “Remarks were then made by Brother Canright on the subject of Systematic Benevolence (S.B.). Taking certain well-ascertained facts as a basis, he showed that if all would come up to the Bible plan of S.B., the amount within our ranks would reach the sum of $150,000 yearly, instead of about $40,000 as it now is. The Lord says, ‘Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse,’ and until this is done, the Lord will not be ‘proved,’ to see whether He will not pour out a blessing so that there shall not be room enough to receive it. Brother White followed with lengthy and stirring remarks on the same subject.

        “Brother Canright offered the following resolutions on the subject of Systematic Benevolence, which were unanimously adopted by the conference and congregation:

        “Resolved, That we believe it to be the duty of all our brethren and sisters, whether connected with churches or living alone, under ordinary circumstances, to devote one-tenth of all their income from whatever source, to the cause of God. And further

        “Resolved, That we call the attention of all our ministers to their duty in this important matter to set it plainly and faithfully before all their brethren and urge them to come up to the requirements of the Lord in this thing.

        “Moved and carried that the chairman appoint a committee of three, himself to be one of that committee, to prepare a tract upon the subject of Systematic Benevolence. The Chair appointed D. M. Canright and U. Smith to act with him as that committee.”–Minutes of the Special Session of the General Conference, published in RH April 6, 1876, p. 108.

        By the year 1878 a change had been made in the plan of figuring the percentage of giving, shifting from approximately one percent per year to the total valuation of property to ten percent of the actual income. The former plan was found to be defective. In one case on the old plan the tithe amounted to $10 per month, while under the new plan of an actual ten percent of income, the tithe amounted to $36 per month.

        As you can see or will see from further study, the church pioneers started with the New Testament method of giving (not tithing but freewill offerings), but because of the influence of so-called leading men, they decided that they would return to the Old Testament method because it would yield more funds and they further stated that it was a requirement of God and solicited the ministers to keep it before the people.

        First God showed Mrs. White the Systematic Benevolent Plan and then He changed His mind and told them to return to the Torah and the old and defunct way of doing things. Mrs. White has a habit of blaming God or the people for her changes in processes and beliefs.

        My point is this: The ministers were told then and they are told today that it is THEIR DUTY to keep the Old Testament law of tithing before the people and to URGE them to do so as endorsed by Ellen G. White. This system is not endorsed by the Bible. For further reading on ‘The History of Tithing in the SDA Church’ please go to:
        http://www.whiteestate.org/issues/Tithe-H&U.html#Some Documentation on Systematic Benevolence and the

        As a former SDA denominational employee, having worked in the treasury department for 37 years, I know first hand the pressure that is placed on pastors to make sure the tithe comes in. Employees can be terminated if they don’t return a faithful tithe. Promising to return tithe is even included in the bapismal vows. In some churches members cannot hold major offices if they don’t return a faithful tithe. When I was first employed by the denomination, 10% was automatically taken out of my check and credited to the Conference Church, thus denying me the privilege of returning it to the Lord myself.

        So, YES, ministers are REQUIRED to teach and preach the importance of unbiblical tithing as endorsed by Mrs. White and leading brethren. Remember, whenever Mrs. White said, “I was shown” it was taken as a word from God. Supposedly He showed her the New Testament way and then He changed His mind and showed her the Old Testament way.

        Most SDAs don’t know that Mrs. White said, “The New Testament does not re-enact the law of the tithe, as it does not that of the Sabbath; for the validity of both is assumed, and their deep spiritual import explained. {RH, May 16, 1882 par. 28} This same statement is found in other sources such as Counsels on Stewardship, pg. 66. Nothing in the Bible is assumed!

        Most sincerely,


  90. Praise the Lord !!!!


  91. we were where you are before ,but the bible directed us,we are moving on, we have full hope.we are preparing for the second coming of our lord and remember he is comin soon where will you be?


    • Hi,

      If you ask me, I will be with the King of kings and Lord of lords. Who are the kings? Rev. 5:10


  92. Dear Pat,

    You were quite correct in cutting off contact with Edem. We are not to put up with those who do not abide in and/or add to the teachings of Christ (2 Jn.9-11). This will only bring us down and elevate our blood pressure. I left the SDA church in 1981 and for 29 years have been deeply frustrated with most SDA’s inability to see scriptural truth.

    What we are dealing with here is a paranormal/demonic addiction by these people for the false philosophies of E.G.White, which is akin to hypnotism and brainwashing, otherwise known by its biblical name of bewitching (Gal.3:1). We laugh at a stageshow hypnotyst who hypnotises people to bark like dogs, but this was the condition of us all in Adventism regarding doctrinal matters, before we got born again.

    We believed doctrinal lies and like some of these people above, mindlessly “parroted” those lies. To claim that there are not 613 commandments of God is an unscriptural LIE stated by Edem. When we were SDA’s, we like Edem, were not “commandment keepers” but liers. Over 30 scriptural references clearly show that these are all God given commands and Israel was obliged to OBEY ALL OF THEM: Exodus 24:3,7; Leviticus 19:37; 20:8,22; 22:31; 25:18; 26:3,14,15; Numbers 15:39,40; Deuteronomy 4:2; 8:1,11; 11:8, 13, 18-22, 26-28, 32; 12:28, 32; 13:18; 27:26; 28:1, 15, 58; 29:9,29; 30:2, 8-18; Joshua 1:7,8; 2 Chronicles 34:21, 24, 31).

    And guess what ? The New Testament’s teaching about the 613 is EXACTLY THE SAME as the Old Testament’s teaching. The Holy Spirit through the Apostle Paul (Galatians 3:10) quoted Deuteronomy 27:26 word for word as being totally applicable to those “under the Law”. ONE and ONLY ONE alternative to being “under the Law” is given in Galatans 5:16-18 – following Jesus Christ through the power of the Holy Spirit. Most SDA’s and Roman Catholics just do not undertand this as many of these people are not born again.

    Many teachings (but not all) of the 613 are reinterpreted and restressed in the teachings of Jesus and the Holy Spirit, as recorded in the New Testament.

    E.G.White’s teaching about the sabbath being the most important law (Early Writings p.33) contradicts the teaching of Christ (1 Tim. 6:3-5). Jesus quotes Deut.6:4,5 & Lev. 19:18 (Mark 12:28-31) word for word as being the most important laws of Scripture – two commandments which Edem would list among “ceremonial laws” because they are not specifically listed in the Ten Commandments.

    Some people would say that I am being unkind and judgemental, but Scriptue clearly indicates that we should “…rebuke your neighbour frankly so that you will not share in his guilt” (Leviticus 19:17 NIV). However to Edem this also would be a “ceremonial law” as this too is not listed in the Ten Commandments. However, Jesus also says: “If your brother sins rebuke him..” (Luke 17:3 NIV). Many SDA’s don’t follow Jesus but instead follow the philosophy of Roman Catholic Philosopher Thomas Aquinas.

    Just think, one of the foundational teachings of Adventisn is actually a Roman Catholic heresy !

    Thomas Aquinas said that “The Mosaic law may be divided into moral, ceremonial and judicial precepts” and that, “all its moral precepts are reducible to the Decalogue” (quoted in D.A.Carson, ed., From Sabbath To Lord’s Day, Grand Rapids: Zondervan Publishing House, 1982, p305).

    Ellen White, who we know was a bit of a copycat to say the least, adopted this philosophy into her own “inspired” teachings, by teaching that, “Moses was commanded to write, as God should bid him, judgements and laws giving minute instructions as to what was required. These directions relating to the duty of the people to God, to one another, and to the stranger, were only the principles of the Ten Commandments amplified” (E.G.White, Patriarchs and Prophets, Mountain View, Calif.: Pacific Press Publishing, 1958, p.364).

    SDA evangelist, John Carter goes even as far as to say that the laws of the Book of the Law can be broken because they do not “show sin” (Carter Report cassette entitled “Modern Preachers Go Wrong”, circa 1981).

    The New Testament reinterprets and restresses many other Old Testament priciples that Adventism blindly considers to be ceremonial laws.

    It is interesting to note that George Vanderman named his TV program “It is Written” after what Adventism would call a ceremonial law. Deuteronomy 8:3 (Matthew.4:4) is not found in the Ten Commandments. SDA’s and their Catholic mates need to look at the whole of God’s revelation (2 Tim.3:16,17).

    We are not to seek revenge or be unforgiving (Lev.19:18; Col.3:13; Eph. 4:32).

    We are not to show favouritism (Lev.19:15; James 2:1,9).

    We are not to be unholy (Lev.19:2; 1 Peter 1:15,16).

    We are not to test God. (Deut.6:16; Matthew 4:7).

    We are not to add to God’s revelation with something that is man-made (Deut.18:20; Galatians 1:6-9; 2 Jn.9-11; Rev. 22:18).

    WE ARE TO LISTEN TO CHRIST! (Deut.18:15; Matthew 17:5; Acts 3:22). (How can this be a law which does not show sin???).

    We are not to practice magic/occultism (Exodus 22:18; Rev.22:15).

    We are not to disrespect government authorities (Exodus 22:28; Acts 23:5; Romans 13:1-7).

    We are not to mistreat orhans and widows (Exodus 22:22,23; James 1:27).

    We are not to convict a person on the testimony of one witness (Deut.19:15; Matthew 18:16; 2 Cor. 13:1).

    We are to confess our sins (Lev.5:5; 1 John 1:8,9).

    We are not to be unequally yoked (Deut. 22:10; 2 Cor. 6:14).

    We are to show mercy (Lev.25:35-43; Matthew 9:13).

    We are to be full of faith and not unbelieving as Israel was (Deut. chapter 1: Numbers chapter 13; Psalm 78:18-22; Hebrews 11:6; John 3:18).

    We are not to lead the blind astray (Lev.19:14; Matthew 15:14.

    Adventism is very much a child of Roman Catholicism. Both of these religions are religions of DENIAL. They both subtley obscure the fact that Christians follow Jesus Christ through the leadership of the Holy Spirit. Both show the three interelated characteristics of false religions: they preach “another Jesus”, “another gospel” and impart another spirit” (2 Cor. 11:4). Adventism is an example of the the Reformation in reverse.

    I thank Mark Martin for his brilliant website http://www.exadventist.com. I highly recomend it.

    I know that Ben has made a descision that he will not regret.

    Bless you
    Mark Sheridan, Sydney, Australia


    • Hello Mark,

      Thanks so much for affirming my decision because it wasn’t easy. I am so grateful and thankful to be out of bondage. I have a real burden to share with others but the SDAs I’ve spoken with are comfortable or afraid to consider what the Bible really says instead of their prophetess.

      Just the other day, one of my Adventist friends was talking about end times and how the Sunday Blue laws will be implemented. I couldn’t help but ask, “Do you really believe Sunday laws will be enforced when America is turning more and more from God? Prayer has been banned from schools, etc; Muslims are growing faster than any religion in North America and they worship on Friday. Muslims would be affected by a Sunday blue law. Will Muslims be mandated to worship on Sunday as well? My friend gave me a blank stare and no response.

      An excerpt from this article was written in 2001. http://www.defense.gov/news/news In the United States, Islam is the fastest growing religion, a trend fueled mostly by immigration. There are 5 million to 7 million Muslims in the United States. They make up between 10,000 and 20,000 members of the American military.article.aspx?id=44689

      From the SDA website http://www.nadadventist.org: Today, as one of the fastest growing Christian Protestant churches, 14 million baptized Seventh-day Adventist members live in 204 countries of the world. This includes more than 1 million in North America.

      Muslims outnumber SDAs. While Muslims are growing, according to the report given at GC 2005, over 1.5 million left Adventism in five years. Mind you, this number is what was reported. It doesn’t include those that are just on the church membership rolls and not attending. When I worked for the conference, purging memberships to only include active members was frowned on because goals are based on membership. The higher the membership, the higher the church’s Ingathering goals, etc. High goals with few people places a burden on the faithful few, but that is not a consideration.

      Adventists live in fear. Fear of the judgment; Fear they won’t make it in because EGW says they can’t say they are saved. Fear of the ‘Time of Trouble’ when they will be without a mediator (according to EGW); Fear of persecution because of their beliefs, thus the Sunday Blue Law, etc. Me thinks they have a persecution or martyr complex. I too was afraid but not any more. I once was blind but now I see and I praise Him every day, many times a day for His deliverance.

      Thanks for the recommendation but I have visited and I love Mark Martin’s site. His information was HIGHLY instrumental in helping me to understand the covenants. I would love to visit his church one of these days and also to fellowship with those that have been freed.

      Signs are being fulfilled worldwide. Just like they thought Jesus was returning in 1843, 1844, they are now looking for something else. He simply admonishes us to watch, pray and be ready because no one knows the day nor the hour.

      This is strictly my opinion. I’ve discovered that when I take the time to think/study for myself and not just accept what I’ve been taught most of my life, the conclusions are different.

      Be blessed!


  93. I need to enlarge on what I said above.

    E.G.White’s teaching that all Christian ethics can be reduced to the Ten Commandments was adopted from those around her. These people’s ancestors brought it from the English church, which in turn, received it from Roman Catholicism. It is a philosophy that looks rational to the spiritually naive “man in the street” and it is used in Australia by SDA evangelists to con the unwary Anglican, Catholic and Methodist, who visit the “Dead Men Do Tell Tales” SDA lectures about Egyptian Pharaohs etc., only to end up hearing that believing in Ellen White, Adventism and the biblically inconsistent doctrine of the Sabbath is their “ticket” to Heaven.

    Colossians 2: 4, 8 warns us not to follow human philosophy and that is just what this. This philosophy was not supernaturally given to Ellen as she claims in Early Writings p.33. In this passage she claims to see the wording of the Sabbath commandment written on the Ten Commandments , as it was in King James English when “delivered to Moses on Sinai”. This was during her supposed trip to Heaven.

    To think that this woman and her followers have deluded and drawn millions into a lost enternity is truely astounding.

    In fact Colossians chapter 2 gives about SEVENTEEN contradictions to the teachigs of Traditional Adventism. This is no coincidence as it illustrates the demonic inspiration of some of these false teachers.

    Bless you
    Mark Sheridan.


  94. Hi Edem,

    The Law is there to show that every person is a sinner and needs the Grace an Mercy of the Lord to be Saved, so there is absolutely nothing you can do to be Saved except believing in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Saviour!
    You will like everyone else always sin, but are freed because of the price Jesus paid on the Cross, not whether you are keeping your Sabbath on a Saturday or how great you are obeying the Law!

    Through the Blood of Jesus we are blameless before the Lord, if you believe there is something else you can do you make the Cross to non effect and you are placing yourself under the Law again! Stop condemning yourself and place yourself in the flow of the river of Grace. You are set free my friend, sin does not have to have dominion over you, don’t focus on sin, but rather on the amazing Grace of Jesus.

    When you love the Lord you don’t worry about how good you are obeying the Law, for it comes naturally, I don’t even know all the 10 Commandments of by heart, because I do not place my focus on the Letter, but the Spirit who gives life!

    2 Corinthians 3:6
    “He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant–not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.”

    I am not going to spend my life condeming myself, if I sin I repent and rejoice in the Grace of the Lord! Where does my supply come from…..me? or Jesus? Well Jesus! If demands are put on my life, like in my working environment, family demands or religious demands(Law) will it be up to me to supply for those needs or Jesus? Well Jesus Christ right? So when you put demands on yourself and saying the you are going to try to uphold and supply for those needs you are saying you don’t need the Grace of the Lord……….so in-effect you are placing yourself under the Law and you will not receive the Grace of God, just like the devil wants it!

    You cannot be in the new Covenant and the old Covenant my dear friend, you need to make a choice, there is also no mixing of the two. Try to understand what happens when you mix the two by trying to understand this Scripture: Mark 2:22
    “And no one pours new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins, and both the wine and the wineskins will be ruined. No, he pours new wine into new wineskins.”

    If you put new wine into old wineskins the skins will burst and you lose everything, you lose the Grace of God!

    You will never experience freedom and rest in the Lord if you accept all kinds of demands on yourself, be thankful for what He did for us on the Cross, spend your time worshiping and praising Him who made it possible for you and me to enter the Kingdom of God!

    Do you now what “gracias” means? It means thanks and comes from the word Grace…….this means we must live a life of thanksgiving with a cheerful heart! When you truly love the Lord you will do what pleases Him, therefore you will live a life of faith, for it is written that you cannot please God without faith, do you think by keeping the Law it is pleasing God? “Without faith it is impossible to please God.” Hebrews 11:6 Do you need faith to believe in Jesus Christ? YES! So if you do, are you pleasing God? YES! Do you need faith to obey the Sabbath or any law? NO! So by doing so are you pleasing God? NO! If you live in the flesh you will always try to do something to receive something, but when Jesus died on the Cross He said “it is finished!” our enemy is slain and all our sins and iniquities are paid for! Why do we not accept that and know that we are made free through His Blood and live a life of abundance! Many of our brothers and sisters are making life so hard for themselves, judging themselves according to the law…….we are sinners and will not get away from it, no matter how great of a person we think we are…we need Jesus as our Savior and that is the bottom line!

    Many churches do not teach Grace, because what happens is that those who hear this truth starts to live a life led by the Holy Spirit and not by doctrines of man/”church”, this is why Jesus was sacrificed, because the pharisees(religious authorities) was losing control over the people…..we are released from any grip a man or devil can have on us, is that not amazing and fantastic! Praise the Lord of lords and King of kings! The name above all names, Jesus Christ!

    My supply is from Jesus Christ and therefore I shall forever place my trust in Him and not myself!
    I am nothing without Him!

    Be blessed my brother in Jesus name!


  95. Hi,

    If SDA is the Church of Christ, why is not called that way?

    I can tell you way, is because they do not truly follow the teachings of Jesus Christ and the New Covenant. If you want to live by the Law, you are welcome to kill yourself, for the Letter kills mate!

    For some it seems smarter not to kill themselves, but rather to live by walking in the Spirit!

    We all have a free will! But there is only one Truth, when we deny it, we perish!


  96. Hi Ben,

    You are welcome to delete my posts as well my friend, especially if it has no purpose, it’s like hanging in the air… ;)

    All the best!


  97. Dear Pat,

    I find it quite amazing that there are SDAs who still believe that “Sunday laws” would one day be introduced. I thought that this would be a belief of the mostly over 65 year old age group of SDAs.

    In Australia, Friday night/Saturday is a very important day in the Christian week. I have attended many Christian men’s Fellowships on Saturdays. I also attend churches such as Hillsong and Christian City Church that have services on Saturday afternoons. Those so called by Adventism, the “Beast Worshipers” (Roman Catholics and Orthodox denominations) also have church services on Saturday afternoons.

    When I left the SDA church to fellowship with Anglicans, my mother was quite suprised when I told her that these young people (on a Church weekend away from home), studied Scripture on the Friday evening and most of Saturday.

    This was so different from my former SDA friends who would use Saturday afternoons to get involved in all sorts of evil and debauchery. The SDA youth culture in Sydney, 30 years ago was particularly directionless and godless.

    Adventism is a false prophetic movement for claiming that Sunday Laws would one day be introduced. Ellen White is to never be feared (Deuteronomy 18:21, 22) as this will NEVER, EVER, HAPPEN.

    A couple of days before he died, a close relative of mine said : “I know what to believe, I am ready to die, I believe in the Sabbath”. To this person going to church on Saturday was his “Jesus”. His ticket to Heaven.

    We must fight this delusion as hard as we can and at every opportunity.

    Maybe we should produce flyer/leaflets with Ellen White’s contradictions to Scripture or SDA leader’s contradictions to Ellen White, with references to the exadventist websites such as nonegw, nonsda, ellenwhiteexposed etc and get them out to as many SDAs that we know.

    Bless all who stand for the real Gospel and are dedicated to the real Jesus.


  98. whatever happens, I pray that this pastor stays connected to our Lord and Savior Jesus. I do not share in his comments or reasons for leaving, I do not know him, but as a child of God, which I believe he is, he is loved. I have love this denomination and still do. I trust that this Pastor will stay connected to God. I have been blessed by God from my youth with the gift of dreams. I have seen what will happen on this earth and it is frightening. I wish that at the end of it all we will meet together and live in HIS presence for ever. God bless you my brother.


  99. It is so interesting that since the beginning of time with Adam and Eve the Word of God was attacked, did the serpent not place doubt “Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?” very slick, then he said “Ye shall not surely die:” so now Eve is wondering who she shall believe as the truth..”For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.” wow, what a temptation, they will be like gods, I believe satan places a temptation in front of every person’s face so that they lose their focus on Jesus Christ.

    So my point is that even today satan is using the same old method to deceive people, so what happens is that people who are in many cases not familiar with God’s Word or born again start to believe “them” and not God as the real Truth.

    What happened to Adam and Eve when they decided to accept another creature’s word above that of God’s, well they got cursed right…..we are not fighting flesh and blood, but powers of darkness, etc.

    The Word of God is the ultimate Truth, no matter what anyone says and it will come to pass!


  100. Hello Ben I have read your letter and the other comments even though I cannot agree with you are support you in your decision you are family and we do love you I pray that God be with you and your family. Peace and Blessings to you

    Your cousin Rochelle


  101. USUALLY,

    When an Adventist becomes an ex-Adventist, it is because he or she never really comprehended the various unique beliefs that we have. They dont understand the 1844 Advent Movement and what happenes; they dont understand the Judgment Message, and they dont understand Ellen White, who she really was and what she actually taught. Furthermore, they dont really comprehend the Scriptures at all.

    One of the big problems is that many of the Conference Leaders are working so hard to bring people into the Church, who dont really have a complete clue as to what we believe. Consequently, they leave afterwards, because they were never firmly “rooted and grounded” in the truth at all.

    Its is better they dont become Adventists at all, or should I say “Professed” Adventists… then for them to come into the Church, misunderstand everything, and then leave the Church… conveying to people that ‘we have a false Gospel’ when they dont even know what they are talking about at all.

    Its very sad, really.

    Claudia


    • Claudia,

      Speaking as an ex-Adventist, you are so correct. I didn’t understand the Investigative Judgment because it is only supported by EGW and not the Bible. I didn’t understand the Scriptures as taught by the church because the church is very ‘selective’ in choosing some and leaving out others that are relevant to prove a point; I didn’t understand how Ellen White could contradict Scripture and claim to be ‘more than a prophet’and plagarized the majority of her works. The church even selected their own independent committee to study her writings and found this to be the case. In some books (eg. Desire of Ages), it was stated that there was hardly an original thought. Yet, the church still wants to promote her more than ever as of this past General Conference. You also might want to check out the 1919 Bible Conference Minutes to see what the leaders really thought of her ‘inspiration’ and how they voted to keep the minutes locked in the vault for 50 years. They could have come clean back then but they chose to deceive the laity. The minutes were discovered by accident and released in the 1970’s.

      You are also quite correct about the people being ill informed when they join the church. From my experience as a member for over 50 years and working for a local conference for 37 years, there is deliberate deception when bringing people into the church. Most of the time, when public meetings are held, they are in halls, auditoriums’, tents, etc. and the name SDA is nowhere to be seen. As children, we were instructed not to let people know our religion until the Sabbath was preached. For the most part, people don’t hear the name Ellen G. White until after baptism, altho she is alluded to in the baptismal vows as the Spirt of Prophecy.

      Perhaps if those who are evangelizing would do a more honest and thorough job of being truthful about who they really are and what they really believe, maybe fewer would join but at least they won’t have new revelations once baptized and would be more inclined to stay.

      Since leaving, the veil has been lifted and Scripture makes so much sense. For instance, I never knew as an Adventist that the Ten Commandments is the Old Covenant. They somehow never thought it was worth referencing. As a matter of fact, I never understood the differences between the Old and New Covenant because when you read the Sabbath School Lessons and EGW, there’s no relative difference. They never used a text like Deut. 4:13 which says, “He declared to you his covenant, the Ten Commandments, which he commanded you to follow and then wrote them on two stone tablets.”
      Once I really understood the covenants, I had to leave and I am truly happy.

      So, yeah, speaking strictly for myself, I thought I understood but when I read my Bible without Mrs. White’s comments, I discovered I had been deceived and most of the ‘uniqueness’ I had been taught and believed all of my life could not be supported by Scripture.

      Most sincerely,

      Patricia Allen


    • Hi Claudia, my name is Justin. I was a 4th generation Adventist. The thing that really got me to reply to you in particular is the point that you’re making that people don’t understand the SDA religion and that’s why they leave. The other person that replied to you pretty much hit a lot of the points that I would make. But, it still somewhat just rubs me the wrong way when this charge of not understanding is brought forth. Paul says the simple gospel, and it is a simple gospel. When those people do leave the church, like I used to see them once they actually see how much EGW has actually to do with doctrine. Or, they may just run into those historical Adventists that can be (not all of them) a bit odd. It’s just one of those SDA sayings that gets thrown around about people who leave. “They didn’t understand it” or “they’ve been deceived”. Or if you start pointing out that the gospel is grace rich and you believe it’s justification through faith, grace only, you get the old SDA montra “well, thats once saved always saved” thinking.
      It’s faith and belief in Christ and the Holy Spirit working in your life to make you the best Christian you can be, not grace plus the 10 commandments, especially the fourth, equals salvation that you are saved. The simple gospel. Well, I could go on, but I’m not going to. But, just please consider this: those people who leave, as you said that “don’t understand” the SDA doctrine. Those people, according to EGW, are now lost having been shown the light of the sabbath and rejecting it. Do you think God would make it so difficult that a person couldn’t understand salvation and how to be saved? I really find that statement, even though I don’t believe you meant it this way, but none the less, just a bit arrogant. Geez, this just popped into my head…wasn’t it Christ that said that a good tree cannot produce bad fruit and a bad tree produce good fruit? Wouldn’t the 1844 disappointment and the teaching that the door of salvation was shut be considered bad spiritual fruit?
      Wow, that was a lot longer than I planned.

      Your brother in Christ,
      Justin


  102. Dear Pastor McPhaull, I rejoice with you in you and your family’s decision to come out of the SDA Church. I am a former member of the Valley Crossroads SDA Church. And I,gave my then pastor, the late Pastor Robinson my letter requesting to take my name off the roll. My journey out actually started in 2003 when I was challenged by the Lord to come after Him with all my heart, soul, mind and strength. I had been an Adventist since 1975, and I truly loved my church and my church family. But when I entered this journey, I was awakened by the Holy Spirit in the wee hours of the morning to be taught by Him and Him alone. This is a discipline that I am still engaged in to this very day. I remember telling Abba Father I wanted the faith of Jesus; that kind of faith that pleased the Father, because I knew the Father was real pleased with His Beloved Son, as His Son did everthing He told Him to do. I wanted to please the Father like that.

    Lo and behold as I read and studied the scriptures and the scriptures only, I discovered the doctrine of the Investigative Judgement could not possibly be true! I bawled like a baby reading the book of Hebrews realizing Jesus was already at the right hand of the Father in the Most Holy Place at the time that book was written, which was about 64 years after Christ’s ascension. I was amazed at reading Christ’s Priesthood was after the order of Melchizedek, and not after the order of Aaron or the Levitical Priesthood, which is most of the foundation of the Investigative Judgement! The Holy Spirit taught me the differences between the old and new covenant, and don’t get me started on God’s Sovereignty and election and predestination and knowing I truly can be assured I am saved; not this wondering and hoping that I’m saved! Have Mercy!!!

    I learned what happened with SDA teaching is that the Word of God is mostly used allegorically or symbolicaly as opposed to being taken literally! Man, that made all the difference in the world!! Discovering that Michael and Jesus is not the same person, that all of my sins were dealt with at the cross, that The Holy Spirit is the seal of God for believers in Christ and not the Sabbath… Wow, wow, wow!!! There is so much more regarding the 2300 day prophesy, inheritence and rewards, the three angels message, who really are the 144,000, what was really nailed to the cross, being a partaker of Christ sufferings, the true position of works, the indwelling of the Holy Spirit – Oh My Goodness!!!

    I could not sit in an Advetist Church no longer! I mean everything was cool as long as Christ, and Christ alone was taught. But then an Adventist dogma would be slipped in, or a quote from the so-called Spirit of Phophecy would be magnified and that was all I could stand! I realized I no longer believed well over 70% of what Adventist taught and I had to go where the bible and the bible alone was upheld.

    Leaving was very, very difficult, because as I said I loved my church and my church family. Not just Crossroads but all of my brothers and sisters in the sister churches. I was not angry, no one had done me wrong. And the Sabbath was a huge issue for me. But reading Colosians, Galatians and especially Hebrews 4 has helped me to realized there is a much better rest that that of the Sabbath Day that God Himself says His people won’t enter in because of unbelief. And that is the blessed rest that Jesus’ says…”Come unto me all ye that labor, and I will give you rest” Glory Hallelujah!!

    I am free and freed indeed. Free from the bondage of sin, free from condemnation, free from doubts and fears… Man I’m not even afraid of death! I used to be, but no longer! I’m free from wondering if I’m really saved! We can be assured of our salvation for truly He who started this thing in us says He will complete it!

    When I realized that fact I understood truly how Amazing God’s grace really is! I better understood justification, sanctification and glorification and God’s role in saving sinners and the process of Him making us His children…Oh, Oh, Oh!!! I glorify God and praise Him with all of my being!!! Hallelujah!! And all that talk of God’s character being on trail! Give me a break! Who’s gonna punish God? Who are we that He needs to vindicate His character to? Umph, umph, umph!!!

    I still have friends and family in the SDA church and I go and minister in song when I’m called to come as I am a singer. My roots are Adventist and I am very, very grateful for I was saved in the Adventist Church! I realized many more brothers and sisters will be saved in the SDA church.

    But my prayers are for the Body Of Christ realizing we true believers in Jesus Christ are all different members of the Body of Christ. I likend SDA’s to being maybe a leg, COGIC perhaps the other leg, Lutherans a hand, Presbyterians another hand and so on! As Jesus’ prayed that we be one and He admonished us to love one another – so be it, Amen!!

    Be encouraged, Pastor and watch the heights the Holy Spirt will take you. We are to be mature Christians. The Holy Spirit’s job is to lead us into all Truth, and we are sanctified by His Truth. His Word is Truth!

    God bless you and your family Pastor.. Glory to God!


  103. I am praying for you. I stepped out of it after 20+ years of being in the lies and dictatorship. They don’t keep the commandments, they defile God’s Holy rules. I am now apart of the House of God. We worship on the Sabbath and keep all the feast days. I love the new church and I hope you will not leave God’s commands out of your life. God bles you, Sir.


  104. Again I wish to encourage Ben in resigning from his position with the SDA denomination.

    There must be many SDA pastors who seek God, get born again and find that the whole SDA religious system is a “snow job”. I feel sorry for these people who may have many financial commitments but are stuck in a job where they have to preach doctrines that are deeply heretical and offensive to God.

    The comments of Claudia Sharp above is typical of many SDAs who wish to discredit those who leave Adventism to follow the real Gospel. These defenders of Adventism do not believe that Jesus, apart from anything that Adventism has ever taught, is the “Light of Life” and those who follow Him, will never walk in darkness (Jn.8:12), regardless of any particular denominational affiliation. As I stated in a previous post above, Adventism contradicts many principles of Colossians Chapter 2. Many of our SDA friends were fooled to think that Ellen White and Adventism contained “all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge” rather than the Biblical Jesus (Col. 2:3 NIV).

    Take the Biblical doctrine of atonement on the cross.

    Ellen White taught that the “blood of Christ…..was not to cancel the sin, it would stand on record in the sanctuary until the final atonement” (Patriarchs and Prophets p. 357).

    According to Ellen White’s teaching about the Investigative Judgement, Jesus is supposed to be offering His blood, atoning for sins again and again until a “final atonement”, will one day be made.

    But what does the Holy Spirit say about the importance of atonement on the cross, “in a single day” ?

    He says that we are saved only if we believe that Jesus died (that is atoned) for our sins according to the Scriptures. According to the Holy Spirit this is of FIRST IMPORTANCE (1 Corinthians 15:1-4). He also says this is the GOSPEL BY WHICH WE ARE SAVED (and it shows no relationship to the “other gospel” of Ellen White).

    What do those Scriptures say ? :

    The “Servant” Jesus (Zechariah 3:8) did away with sin in “a single day” ( Zech.3:9). The death of the “Servant” Jesus resulted in the forgiveness of sins (Isaiah 53).

    “…We have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all” (Hebrews 10:10 NIV).
    “…by one sacrifice he has made perfect for ever those who are being made holy” (Heb. 10:14 NIV).

    On the cross, He forgave us our sins (Col. 2:13-15)

    See also Roman 3:25; Acts 20:28; Matt. 26:28; 1 Peter 1:18-19; Rev.1:5; Heb. 9:12,14,26; 1 John 1:7.

    We already have the forgiveness of sins (past tense) Col.1:13,14; Psalm 103:9-12.

    The head of the Australian SDA Church in the early 1980’s claimed that the Investigative Judgement is “not an incidental or dispensable doctrine, but an integral component of the faith, a necessary dimension of that redemtive process”(K.S.Parmenter, Autralasian Record, April 5 1982, p.3). In other words believing the opposite to that which the Bible says about atonement is essential to salvation!!! This statement by Parmenter shows an abysmal lack of spiritual insight into a doctrine which is clearly taught by Scripture. (Many of these people including Ellen White show all the characteristics of people who are not born again).

    Much has been spoken about the exegetical monstrosity of the 1844/Investigative Judgement doctrine and some of this could be found at the exadventist.com website.

    But ah yes isn’t it nice to give the old SDA Church a “gospel coat of paint” ?.

    In the early 1980’s the “great champion” of SDA “evangelism” John Carter, in Australia contadicted his “infallible prophetess” by saying he “wants to belong to a church that teaches that Christ’s blood cleanses from every sin” (Carter Report cassette entitled “Is it necessary to belong to a church to be saved?”) He also states, quite rightly, that Christ has made a “complete atonement” for sin on the cross (Carter Report cassette entitled “Modern Preachers Go Wrong”). Although Ellen warned that “the last deception of Satan” would be to deny her teachings, SDA ministers in Australia often contadict her teachings when it suits them.

    John Carter later says in the June 11, 1983 copy of “Intrasyd” : “I love Des Ford….Most of the great prophecies I teach from Daniel and Revelation, I present powerfully because of the classes I attended at Avondale, which he taught. The sad thing is that he no longer believes them. His presentations back there were so much more scholarly and forceful than what he teaches now, and what he then taught was Bible truth. It grieves me to see him now denying them and going futher away from these great truths” (John Carter quoted in Intrasyd June 11, 1983).

    What did Ford find out about Dan. 8:14 – that it had nothing to do with the idea of no atonement on the cross as Ellen White taught. In fact Carter previously said that he believed in a “complete atonement for sin on the cross” (John Carter, Modern Preachers Go Wrong). Therefore John Carter actually believes what Ford believes about atonement on the cross, as the non cancelation of sin on the cross (Patriarchs and Prophets p.357) is now unacceptable to many Australian SDAs who were starting to “smell a rat”.

    I have kept these documents and teaching cassettes as a witness to the deception that has gone on in Adventism for far too long. Intrasyd (a publication of the Greater Sydney Conference of SDAs), did a “snow job” smear campign to discredit Desmond Ford.

    The official newspaper of the SDA church in Australia, the “Australasian Record” never publishes anti-Adventist letters or material which is hostile to the doctrines of Ellen White. A few years later in 1985 it published an interesting letter which represents the philosophy of many but not all SDAs: “The cross has nothing to do with true Christianity – being a pagan symbol… The reason the devil used the cross for the death of Jesus was that he hoped God would not have anything to do with Jesus for being nailed to the devil’s symbol…” (Ian Hoare, Queensland, Letter to the Editor, Australasian Record, March 2, 1985, p.14).

    The SDA Church in Australia is probably teaching different teachings to those taught in the USA Church. What we find is that Adventism is a “theological tower of Babel” teaching organised and disorganised confusion. With pastors contradicting themselves, contradicting each other, contradicting Ellen, contradicting Scripture and many instances of Ellen contradicting herself and Scripture.

    Claudia’s claim that ex SDAs “dont really comprehend the Scriptures at all” and “they dont even know what they are talking about at all” applies very much not only to most of its laity but goes right to the top of the organisation – the blind leading the blind.

    Engaging most Adventists, Jehovah’s Witnessess, Mormons, Christian Scientists etc in a theological discussion is a bit like arguing with the family budgerigar about Einstein’s Theory of Relativity – they just don’t get it and they will never get it while they will not humble themselves and plead with God for the Holy Spirit to show them the truth (Luke 11:13).

    I thank Ben for the opportunity to get this message to people who need to know what a deceptive, dishonest religion Adventism is.

    Bless You.


  105. This is all very confusing. A tug-of-war between SDA and former SDA and their views and experience in the church. I have been an SDA for nearly 13 years. I never studied EGW because I don’t believe that her words can’t save my soul, only the Holy Word of God, and my belief in Jesus can. But to come on this website and see some of the bashing comment(and from some ministers mind you) is disturbing. I question why all the bashing? If you were lead by the Lord, you wouldn’t do such things. I just want to be apart of a fellowship that has a love for the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, and that the teachings are accurate and understanding. And to be stirred, and confused by your comments makes me question my Faith in God, and the church. I will just pray to God for more understanding, and to pray for those to have understanding.


  106. Hello everyone. I feel compelled to comment on this post. Firstly, here is where i stand. I know that Jesus Christ paid it all. It by accepting him, that we are saved.His strength is perfect is his grace is sufficient for all of us, if we just let him into our lives.

    By accepting him, there will be obvious changes in someone. Their life and actions will be more in tune with his will. In other words sin will be something that will bring guilt and repentance. With this said, if Jesus Christ is accepted, one would automatically have desire to obey him, not out of obligation but love.This is where the scribes and pharisees fell short. The law was something they were obsessed with, but Christ was far from their hearts. This is absolutely wrong. Jesus came to teach and show, to be an example.

    I view things so differently from what I have been reading on here. I want do God’s will, my desire is to serve, even though i fall short everyday, I go down on my knees and beg for forgiveness, and Christ my High priest pleads my case, regardless of my guilt. We all deserve death, that’s just a consequence of sin. I don’t want to get into this Adventist and ex Adventist argument.. It’s based so much on self..pride.. who’s right and who’s wrong. People let us turn to scripture, what does the bible have to say about the sabbath? about prophets, about false prophets? about God’s remnant? about final day prophecies?

    This i Know. If you love G


    • Accidentally clicked enter, but let me continue this post

      According to the bible, if you love God keep his commandments John 14:15 There are 10 commandments, and the very fact that majority of this world has a problem with the 4th one … is just weird. I remember speaking to this young man about the commandments. Very intelligent, well read, and God fearing friend of mine. He basically said in alot of words that the 4th commandment cannot be kept. I didnt even bring it up, he seemed okay with all the others except the 4th.

      Let me just add, because i know people will be finding points of attack for this. I don’t believe that one can or will be saved by trying to obey the 10 commandments. Works alone cannot save someone. This is where the scribes and pharisees fell short.However, one cannot accept Jesus Christ.. and not do anything, remain in sin, stagnant. Believing is not enough as show by this verse

      YOU BELIEVE THAT THERE IS ONE GOD. YOU DO WELL. EVEN THE DEMONS BELIEVE- AND TREMBLE

      BUT DO YOU WANT TO KNOW, O FOOLISH MAN, THAT FAITH WITHOUT WORKS IS DEAD? James 2 19-20

      Now sin is transgression of the law 1 John 3:4
      therefore, if there wasn’t a laws given by God, there would be no sin, since sin is transgression of the law. With that being said, we the 10 commandments is important. It shows us God’s love and we obey it out of love for God, not in anyway pointing fingers at others who don’t since we have all sinned and come short of God’s glory.

      Why is the seventh day sabbath so important? It’s just as important as any of the commandments of course, revelations says that in the last days the saints would be those who keep the commandments and have the faith of Christ. Here are the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and have the faith of Christ Revelations 14:12

      It is clear that the last day persons who accept Christ will keep his commandments.. all of it. We call can be saved, God has his people in every denomination, race, walk of life, social status. Why the attack on the 4th one though? The devil has a counterfeit for everything its very apparent. For instance, God created man for woman, but homosexuality is now rampant. God created sex for marriage, sex is now something based on self gratification and feelings. God created a seventh day sabbath. Persons observe the first day. Make no mistake, i am no judging anyone. I fulllyyyy acknowledge that those same persons could be in the kingdom and I may not.According to Paul, people will fall in and out of the race, It’s he who endures till the end who will be saved. Okay time to get to the point

      The sabbath is the only commandment that is being attacked with such Great force. Meaning it is the one that will probably not be observed in the end days. Which we are living in.. since its not being kept by the majority of people. I Know God is Just in all things. He knows the condition of the heart. But since the sabbath is the commandment the one with the most controversy, even being changed in some bibles. Isn’t it safe to say that it will be the determining factor as to how committed people are to Christ? As i said before, all the commandments are important. His law is perfect. But! How can you claim to want to follow Christ all the way and ignore one of his commandment because of some writings off the internet etc.

      The devil is at work people, of course he wants us to disobey. Its a daily battle to stay withing the arms of our savior, we always leave him. He never leaves us. All this arguement and talk about cults and adventism and ellen G white is exactly what the devil wants us to do. There is only one truth, truth is absolute not relative. Truth can only be found in Jesus Christ. It’s the condition of the heart. Keeping the 10 commandments doens’t guarantee salvation!! of course not. But acception Christ as our personal savior and high priest, and having a closer walk with him by observing his commandments will.

      If two groups claim to accept and love Christ, and one keeps his 10 commandments and the other ignores one of them, that’s an obvious distinction. Seek a closer walk with Christ, one where he is our everything. Bashing a church and name calling never got anyone saved. There will always be finger pointers, back biting, hypocrites in every denomination/ religion. The bible says the wheats and the tears will grow together until the Harvest. Matthew 13 24-30. So ofcourse there will be people who think they are high and mighty, of course there will be persons stuck in their holy bubble, of course there will be persons who think they’re the one.. the only ones who will be saved.

      That’s besides the point! Let’s focus on Christ, his love for his, his compassion, his mercy, Calvary. How can we not sing his praises? how The God of david, of Abraham, the God of the sabbath, the beginning and the end, The alpha and Omega.

      The God who always had a prophet, The God who came to teach and show that obsession with the law will not save an individual but it was about a personal walk with Jesus Christ. He came fulfill the law! The God who saves, who is still in the miracle working business.

      He came to save, not to condemn. Who are we to condemn? who are we to say that adventism is a cult? who are we to create a website based on criticism? The time is at hand and we are wasting precious seconds. Let us study the gospel, with fear and trembling. God will direct our paths completely if we allow him to by reading his word.

      May Christ be with us all.


      • Hi,

        John 14:15 says “If you love me, you will obey what I command.”

        Yes, if I love someone truly I will do anything to please him not because I must but because I love him. We know what is right and wrong without running with a law book under our arms, because we have the Holy Spirit that guides us and the Law is written on our hearts.

        If you say we must keep His commandments, which ones are referred too? All?
        Then you cannot make a discrimination between the 10 Commandments and the Mitzvah(613 commandments) which is also in the Word of God. If you do no not you are a hypocrite. Why you may ask, well read the Scripture “For whosoever shall keep the WHOLE law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.” (James 2:10). Would you want God to judged by the Law or by Grace given to us because of Jesus Christ our Messiah? I truly believe it all depends what Covenant you accepted, the New or the Old.

        Therefore I believe that verses like: “Hebrews 8:13 In that He says, “A new covenant, ” He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.” and “2 Corinthians 3:6-8 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter(LAW) but of the Spirit; for the letter(LAW) kills, but the Spirit gives life. But if the MINISTRY OF DEATH(LAW), written and engraved on stones(LAW), was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious?” is very important so that we do not fall in the trap of satan who wants us to fall back on tradition which nullifies the Word of God..(Mark 7:13)

        By saying you have to follow the Sabbath and suggests that the church must do it on Saturdays, that to me is tradition/legalism which in effect nullifies the Word of God. It lets me think of the pharisees, I can only imagine telling the people you must do this and this if you want to be in right standing with God, but is it not interesting how Jesus referred to them as a brood of vipers!!

        I believe we need to focus on the love we have for Jesus, rather than seeing how good we can uphold the 10 Commandments hoping to achieve Salvation…..

        John 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

        Amen


  107. SDAs CLAIM THAT THE DOCTRINE OF THE SABBATH IS THE REAL BIBLICAL DOCTRINE, BUT THE SCRIPTURES SHOW THAT WHEN WE WERE ADVENTISTS, WE BROKE ALL OF THE GODGIVEN INTERPRETATIONS OF THE COMMANDMENT CONTAINED IN EXODUS 20:8-11. THE SDA DOCTRINE OF THE SABBATH IS A INCONSISTENT UNBIBLICAL FALSEHOOD.

    SDA John Carter says that “the Bible is the only guide to Christians” , “..the hardest thing for a person to take…is to find that old ideas are not taught in Scripture…” , “Scripture is the final standard..” , “..that which cannnot be supported by Scripture is a vain and superfluous invention of Satan himself…” “..If it came after Christ and the Apostles, then it is not part of the Word of God…” (Carter Report Cassette, entitled, “Trial By Jury”, circa 1980). E.G. White severely criticised Catholics as “..those who laid down the banner of Christ and departed from the faith which was once delivered to the saints Jude 3″ (E.G.White, The Controversy, p.51).

    These comments are certainly true.

    However, John Carter on another occasion says that people living before the SDA message was preached (ie before 1844), “did not have the truth” on the Sabbath (Carter Report Cassette entitled, “Why So Many Churches?” circa 1980).

    Ellen White also said, “I saw that the present test on the Sabbath could not come until the mediation of Jesus was finished, and he passed within the second veil; therefore, Christians who fell asleep before the door was opened into the most holy, when the midnight cry was finished…1844, and who had not kept the true Sabbath, now rest in hope; for they had not the light and test on the Sabbath which we now have” (E.G.white, Early Writings pp.42,43).

    Ellen’s teaching shows a defective veiw of what Scripture says about Jesus (Col.2:3) and a defective veiw of the Holy Spirit who searches all things (1 Cor.2:10). Much more could be said about these denials.

    It is also interesting to note that Ellen taught that, “I was shown that the commandments of God..” (ie primarily her teaching on the Sabbath) “..and the testimony of Jesus Christ relating to the SHUT DOOR could not be separated” (E.G.White, Early Writings p.42). Therefore Adventism’s doctrine of the Sabbath is irrevocably bound to the early SDA teaching that God had shut the door of mercy to those who rejected the Millerite date setting for the second coming.

    However, God gave Israel certain commandments which were His, not man’s interpretation of the law, “do not work on the Sabbath” as found in Exodus 20:8-11. These God given laws are:

    All food was not to be prepared on the Sabbath. No boiling of water (Exodus 16:23).

    No travel was allowed on the Sabbath: “..everyone is to stay where he is on the seventh day; no-one is to go out” (Exodus 16:29 NIV).

    No-one was to gather wood to light a fire on the Sabbath (Num.15:32-36).

    No fire was to be lit on the Sabbath, even at home (Exodus 35:2,3).

    Nothing was allowed to be carried on the Sabbath (Jer. 17:21,22)

    God also gave other laws which were “lasting” regulations concerning the Sabbath (Lev.24:5-8; 2 Chronicles 2:4).

    If you are going to be a Sabbatarian there is no point in being a phony one.

    Israel was commanded to obey 613 laws not just nine out of ten commands plus the teachings of a 19th century visionary. See my first post on June 18, 2010 above. Again, Galatians 3:10 shows that Deut. 27:26 is no “ceremonial law”. Over 30 passages of Scriture say that Israel was oblged to obey 613 commandments. If SDA’s think that they live under the law, then they are obliged to obey the whole law.

    Ironically when we were SDAs we had to go to that which we have called “CEREMONIAL LAW” to find the command to meet together on a weekly basis (Leviticus 23:2,3), no such command is spoken of in the wording of the Ten Commandments, nor is it implied. Exodus 20:8-11 merely teaches that no work is to be done on the Sabbath.

    The Sabbath in the Old Testament certainly was a test to the Israelite (Num:32-36; Exod. 35:2,3), YET TO ADVENTISM UP TO THE TIME OF 1844, IT LOOSES ITS IMPORTANCE AS A TEST, AND THEN BECOMES A TEST AGAIN AFTER 1844 – yet Ellen White says that, “…God has not changed the Sabbath, for He never changes” (E.G.White, Early Writings, p.33), “The Lord is unchangeable, therefore His law is immutable…”(E.G.White, Early Writings, p.65) and “..the Sabbath has lost none of its meaning..” (E.G.White, Testimonies For The Church, vol.9, p.18).IN REALITY THE SDA DOCTRINE OF THE SABBATH CONSTITUTES THE TEACHING OF A NEW “GOSPEL” BECAUSE ELLEN IN HER WORDS SAID, “..they had not the light and test on the Sabbath which we now have..” (E.G.White, Early Writings, p.43).

    In a letter to Pastor G.I. Butler, Ellen claims to “have been in communication with heavenly messengers” who had given her “..the gospel messages for this last generation..” ( Letter 86, 1906, quoted in the Australasian Record, June 21 1982 p.3). In other words a direct contradiction of Galatians 1:6-9.

    Compare the following passage from Ellen White’s Early Writings with Ephesians 2:14-16.

    “I saw that the holy Sabbath is, and will be, the SEPARATING WALL between the true ISRAEL of God and UNBELIEVERS; and that the SABBATH IS THE GREAT QUESTION, TO UNITE the hearts of God’s dear waiting saints.” E.G.White, Early Writings, p.33, (emphasis my own).

    “For Christ Himself has brought us peace by making JEWS and GENTILES one people. With his own body He broke down the WALL THAT SEPARATED THEM and kept them enemies. HE ABOLISHED THE JEWISH lAW WITH ITS COMMANDMENTS AND RULES, in order to create out of the two races one new people in UNION WITH HIMSELF, in this way making peace. By HIS DEATH ON THE CROSS Christ destroyed their enmity; by MEANS OF THE CROSS HE UNITED both races into one body and brought them back to God” Ephesian 2:14-16 The Good News Bible (emphasis my own).

    Although God entered His rest in Genesis 2:2,3 the Sabbath was not given as a commandment until after the Exodus. Much has already been writen on this subject. The word Sabbath is not mentioned in the book of Genesis. Israel showed they were not familiar with the keeping of the Sabbath when it was first given as a commandment in Exodus 16. The covenant was not made with their fathers (Deut.5:3) and was given to remind them of deliverence from Egypt (Deut.5:15). Nehemiah says the Sabbath was made known to Israel only after the Exodus (Nehem.9:14). Ezekiel says the Sabbath was given after the Exodus (Ezek. 20:10-12). The Law was given to Israel alone (Psalm 147:19,20). Then there are the Scriptures in the N.T. that show that the Law “was added” 430 years after Abraham. The fact that all nations have some form of marriage ceremony and that Israel alone has the Sabbath shows that it was given only to Israel.

    Not only this, but the Sabbath was not always kept throughout Israel and Judah’s history (Lamentations 2:6,9; Hosea 2:11).

    Lets face when we were SDA’s, we and every other SDA in existence tended to make up our own “doctrine” of the Sabbath as we went along, depending on who was watching us at the time. The SDA concept of the Sabbath is changing from generation to generation as nothing is clearly Biblically fixed or established. The SDA doctrine of the Sabbath is a “messageless message” very often based on an emotional attachment to Adventism and an inability to accept the truth – which was the whole reason why the 1844 disapointment and the formulation of the “Investigative Judgement” doctrine happened in the first place.

    The best friend of Jesus who also wrote about the Commandments of God, said that Jesus broke the Sabbath (Jn.5:18). Jesus did this to show that the needs of people and His own ministry came before the Sabbath, which He treated with indifference.

    The idea that if it is permissable to break the Sabbath then it is ok to break any other law of the Ten Commandments is not a sound argument. It amazes me to see how SDAs still repeat this philosophy of EGW, found in Early Writings. This is just as foolish as saying that it ok to be unholy (Lev.19:2; 1 Peter 1:15,16), to show favouritism (Lev.19:15; James 2:1,9), to be unforgiving or hate Roman Catholics (Lev.19:18:)and not listen to Christ (Deut.18:15; Acts 3:22), because these principles are not found in the Ten Commandments and are included with laws such as those of Lev.19:19. “Island girl” needs to realise that this is a philosophy adopted by Adventism indirectly from Roman Catholicism (See my first post June 18,2010).

    I am sorry to be a bit offensive here but I have to say the truth. Not only do non born again SDA’s not understand much about Scripture, most of these people have a pitifully small “spiritual attention span”. They also have a degree of spiritual “laziness”, that goes right to the top of the organisation. I know what it was like to be like this, but what a difference it makes when one genuinely asks Jesus Christ to be real in their lives. To guide them in the knowledge that is important to live the Christian life. I did this back in the early 1980,s and it was as though someone had turned on a light. God wants to give us His Spirit (Luke 11:13), but so many people in various churches (not just Adventism) think that they belong to the “true faith” because they were born into a denomination. Very often these denominations follow cleverly devised religious trickery that denies the Gospel and the New Birth.

    “Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves. Do you not realise that Christ Jesus is in you – unless, of course you fail the test ? And I trust that you will discover that we have not failed the test.” (2 Cor.13:5 NIV). Being in the TRUE FAITH is that we live in union with Jesus (1 John 5:11,12), abide in his teachings (2 Jn. 9-11), obey His commandments which are His teachings (1 Jn. 3:19-24) and are born again and lead by His Spirit (Rom.8:9-14) – the real Seal of God (Eph.1:13; 4:30; 2 Cor.1:21,22).


  108. Dear “Pastor”, I respect your position and your point of view for, as a seventh day adventist I have learned to respect every one opinion. But let me tell you that I discover in your letter that you did not now at all the seven day adventist movment which is the only one church of God. but yet, your position must not surprise any Christian who Know very well the seven day adventist church and its mission. We know that we are living the last days, we know that the church will triumph any way because no where in Bible it’s question of another church or more than one church. Jesus has is own church on earth and He make it clear for anyone who need to follow the truth that this church is characterized by The God’ten commandments and the testamony of Jesus which is the spirit of prophecy.
    We also know that the church doesn’t have to triumph with every body like the little church of Jesus at the very bigining did not triumph with judas.
    There is something i don’t find in your letter, as leader, it’s not sufficient to say that the seven day adventist is not the true church, you must also guide to the true church. What is the true church? all of the others, except the seven day adventist? the one you came from for your mission or the one you are building? YOUr followers have to know. and I think you will be honest enouhg to guide them to the true church.

    Good luck!


  109. Hello everyone,

    While searching the Internet, I discovered a brilliant document entitled “Lying For God” by Kerry Wynne at http://www.bible.ca .


  110. Hello everyone,

    “THIS IS HOW THE JUDGEMENT WORKS: the light has come into the world, but people love the darkness rather than the light, because their deeds are evil. Anyone who does evil things hates the light and will not come to the light, because he does not want his evil deeds to be shown up. But whoever does what is true comes to the light in order that the light may show that what he did was in obedience to God.” (John 3:19-21 The Good News Bible).

    Who is the LIGHT ? (John 8:12; 12:46-50), certainly not the “new light of White” and her confusing, inconsistent and anti-biblical teachings. Nor is it the latest guru to arise in the SDA or any other religious movement.

    The Old Testament predicted the coming Messiah who would speak God’s real message for the last days (Deuteronomy 18:15; Acts 3:22,23: John 1:45). Jesus is the “true light that gives light to every man” (John 1:9 NIV). His message to the world constitutes the unchanging Gospel message of the Apostles (Galatians 1:12; John 16:12-15) and this message should not be added to, or corrupted by a new message arising in 1844 (Galatians 1:6-9; 2 John:9-11) Just look at the way that SDAs add to the book of Revelation (Rev. 22:18).

    Jesus has told us “everything” (John 4:25) and has opened “all the hidden treasures of God’s wisdom and knowledge” (Colossians 2:3 Good News Bible).

    In his letters to the churches and his preaching, the apostle Paul had preached “the whole will of God” (Acts 20:27 NIV). This Gospel is therefore “the word of God in its fullness” (Colossians 1:25 NIV). Paul “fully proclaimed the gospel of Christ” (Romans 15:19 NIV).

    We are not to be moved from the hope of the Aposolic Gospel (Colossians 1:23) to the legalism and hopelessness of E.G.W’s teachings. God’s message has been fully proclaimed to the Gentiles in the first century (2 Timothy 4:17).

    We therefore should “contend for the faith that was ONCE FOR ALL entrusted to the saints” (Jude 3 NIV).

    There was nothing mysterious or hidden about the biblical Old Testament doctrine of the Sabbath – a doctrine that we all broke every Saturday, when we were Adventists (see my post on July 25, 2010). However, the Gospel is from Christ (Galatians 1:12), and is about Jesus and His teachings (Romans 1:3; John 16:14). The Gospel is “the mystery that has been kept hidden for ages and generations, but is NOW DISCLOSED TO THE SAINTS” (Colossians 1:26 NIV). Therefore the eternal Gospel spoken of in Rev. 14:6,7 is not the inconsistant SDA doctrine of the Sabbath, as the real Sabbath doctrine was well and truely disclosed clearly in the Old Testament.

    Those who live in union with Christ by the Holy Spirit have been given fullness (Colossians 2:10), regardless of certain denominational affiliations. They “have the mind of Christ” (1 Corinthians 2:16 NIV). They have the Spirit who “searches all things, even the deep things of God” (1 Cor.2:10 NIV). Everyone who is not born again of the Holy Spirit, will think that what I am writing is “foolishness” (1 Cor. 2:14,15), but I expect this attitude from these people.

    As long as the Holy Spirit teaches us we do not need the Pope or Ellen to tell us their theories on how to know God (1 John 2:27).

    There is ONE FAITH, not “one faith plus another arising in 1844″ (Ephesians 4:5). Jesus commanded the Church to hold to his teachings until He comes (Rev. 2:25), that is by not adding or subtracting from them.

    Peter could say; “His divine power has given us EVERYTHING WE NEED FOR LIFE AND GODLINESS through our knowledge of him who called us by his own glory and goodness” (2 Peter 1:3 NIV). The true Christian will follow Jesus, the “One Foundation” (1 Cor. 3:11), not someone else or some religious movement arising in 1844 (John 10:4,5). Salvation is found only in Him (Acts 4:12), not a denomination.

    Those who reject the Biblical Gospel of Jesus Christ to fabricate, follow and teach “other gospels” (2 Cor. 11:4,13-15), will be cursed by God (Galatians 1:6-9; 2 Thessalonians 1:8), because their minds have been made blind by the devil (2 Cor. 4:3-6).

    A Holy Spirit led allegiance to the Aposollic Gospel must determine every doctrine and practise of a Christian’s life.

    To say that the confussion of the 1844/SDA message is what a Christian should follow is to deny what Jesus and the Holy Spirit said about His unalterable message. SDAs who believe in Ellen White are really saying that the Holy Spirit now contradicts what He wrote in the New Testament. This is a serious heresy indeed.

    Consider the passage of 1 Timothy 4:1-7.

    “The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God has created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth….” (1 Tim. 4:1-3 NIV). (Called “meats” in the King James Version).

    Ellen and James White were both married in 1846 but dissuaded others in the movement to marry. Ellen taught that it was OK to eat meat but not “unclean” meats. On other occasions she claimed that vegetarianism was essential to salvation. She however, ate oysters and pork. References for this can be found at the many “non SDA” type of websites and these references can be checked at the White Estate official website for her writings.

    Ellen White fulfilled ALL conditions of the Holy Spirits prophecy mentioned in 1 Timothy 4:1-7.

    What should we then do with this information ???

    “If you point these things out to the brothers, you will be a good minister of Christ Jesus, brought up in the truths of the faith and of good teaching that you have followed. Have nothing to do with godless myths and old wives tales; rather train yourself to be godly”. (1 Tim. 4:6,7 NIV).

    Mark Sheridan Australia


  111. The New Testament presents Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit and the Apostolic Gospel as being everything and more to the Christian that the Law was to Old Covenant Judaism. This has profound implications for SDAs and Roman Catholics, as both of these religions have cunningly, subtly and not so subtly, denied and obscured the fact that we owe our alligience to Jesus Christ alone.

    The Law was called the “word” (Ps. 119:9,17,42, NIV), “the word of truth” (Ps. 119:43, NIV). Jesus is the “word…full of grace and truth” (John 1:1,14, NIV). The Gospel which is about Christ (Rom.1:2,3; 1 Cor.15:1-4) and from Christ (Gal.1:12; Jn. 16:12-15), is the “the word of God in its fulness” (Col.1:25, NIV), “the word of truth” (Eph.1:13, NIV). The Holy Spirit is the “Spirit of truth” (Jn.14:17, NIV).

    The law was called “the way of truth” (Ps.119:30, NIV), but Jesus is “the way and the truth and the life” (Jn.14:6, NIV).

    The Old Testament says “your statutes are my delight; they are my counsellors” (Ps. 119:24, NIV). Jesus is the “Wounderful Counsellor” (Is. 9:6, NIV). The Holy Spirit is “the Counsellor” (Jn. 14:16,26; 15:26; 16:7, NIV).

    The law was a “teacher” until the time of the Messiah (Gal.3:19-25). Jesus said, “If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples…” (Jn. 8:31, NIV). The Holy Spirit is the christian’s teacher, “…as long as his Spirit remains in you, you do not need anyone to teach you. For his Spirit teaches you about everything, and what he teaches is true, not false. Obey the Spirit’s teaching then, and remain in union with Christ” (1 Jn. 2:27, The Good News Bible).

    The Law was “a lamp to my feet and a light for my path” (Ps. 119:105, NIV), but now in the N.T. “the Lamb is its lamp. The nations will walk by its light…” (Rev. 21:23,24, NIV. See also Jn.8:12).

    The true Israelite “whose ways are blameless”, walked according to the 613 commands of the law (Ps. 119:1-3, NIV). In the N.T., those who are blameless “follow the lamb wherever he goes” (Rev. 14:4,5, NIV). Paul said that we should, “walk according to the Spirit” (Gal. 5:16; Rom. 8:4, RSV).

    The Ten Commandments were called the “words of the covenant” (Exod. 34:28, NIV). Jesus is the Word and minister of the New Covenant (Heb. 8:6), who has made the “stone tablets of the covenant” (Heb. 9:4, NIV) as a system of law, “obsolete” (Heb. 8:13, NIV). The ministry of the life-giving Spirit (2 Cor. 3:17,18) has caused the law including the tablets of stone (2 Cor. 3:3,7), with its glory to be “done away” (2 Cor. 3:11, KJV).

    Circumcision and the Sabbath were “everlasting signs” of the covenant between God and Israel (Gen. 17:9-14; Exod. 31:13). The sign of circumcision was called a “seal of…righteousness” (Rom. 4:11, NIV) and meant subjection to the whole 613 commands of the law (Gal. 5:2,3). Circumsion is an O.T. symbol for the work of the Holy Spirit (Col. 2:11) and together with the Sabbath, are “shadows” to the reality of Christ (Col. 2:11-17). The idea that gentiles are subject to circumsision is a doctrine of “those dogs” (Phil. 3:2, NIV). The Holy Spirit is now the “Seal” of God (Eph. 4:30; 1:13). Jesus is a “sign” (Is. 7:14; Lk. 2:34; 11:30). Christ’s body and blood are our Covenant (Matt. 26:26-28; 1 Cor. 11:24,25). Jesus is a “covenant” (Is. 42:6; 49:8). The law was a “shadow” not the reality (Heb. 10:1). It is interesting that the Ten Commandments were made of stone, yet Jesus is the “stone” the people of the law rejected.

    The Psalmist promised to speak of the law “before kings” (Ps. 119:46, NIV), but the Christian is to confess Jesus (Rom. 10:9).

    The Israelite was sanctified by obedience to the Torah (Ps. 119:25,28,29,37,40,93), but the Chritian is sanctified and renewed by the Holy Spirit (2 Cor. 3:18). It is God who stops us from falling (2 Cor. 1:21,22).

    The Psalmist expected persecution for obeying the law (Ps. 119:22,23,69,84-87) but Christians are persecuted for following Jesus (Jn. 15:19,20).

    Although the Psalmist had obeyed the Torah, he said, “I wander about like a lost sheep; so come and look for me, your servant..” (Ps. 119:176 The Good News Bible). Jesus is the “good shepherd” (Jn. 10:11-16).

    The Psalmist could claim that he had more wisdom, insight and understanding than those without the law (Ps. 119:98-100). Christians have the “mind of Christ” (1 Cor. 2:16, NIV). Jesus is our wisdom (Col. 2:3) The Spirit “searches all things” (1 Cor. 2:10-12, NIV).

    The Psalmist said, “..I compose songs about your commands” (Ps. 119:54, The Good News Bible), but in the New Testament “..they sang a new song…” (Rev. 5:9, NIV).

    The Psalmist said, “The law from your mouth is more precious to me than…silver or gold” (Ps. 119:72, NIV). Faith in Christ is “of greater worth than gold” (1 Pet. 1:7, NIV). Everything else is “rubbish” even a “righteousness of my own that comes from the law” (Phil. 3:8,9, NIV).

    Israel said, “…if we are careful to obey all this law before the Lord our God, as he commanded us, that will be our righteousness” (Deut. 6:25, NIV). Jesus however, is “the Lord our Righteousness” (Jer. 23:5,6; 33:14-16).

    The Festival of Pentecost became associated with the giving of the law at Mt. Sinai and the birth of the Israelite nation. At the Festival of Pentecost (which was a Sunday Lev. 23:15,16), the Holy Spirit was given and the Christian Church established. The Holy Spirit’s testimony to the will of God, relaces the system of law given at Sinai (2 Cor. 3:3-18; Rom. 7:6; Gal. 5:18). The Spirit was given apart from law (Acts 15:8-20; Gal. 3:2,5).

    The Ten Commandments were called the “testimony” (or witness) Exod. 31:18; 32:15 agaist Israel. In the N.T. the “testimony” is the Apostolic Gospel (Rev. 1:2,9), which is from Christ (Gal. 1:12; Jn. 16:12-15) and is about Christ (Rom. 1:2,3; 1 Cor. 15:1-4). It is about “..the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for all men- the TESTIMONY given in its proper time” (1 Tim. 2:2:5,6, NIV). “Anyone who believes in the Son of God has this TESTIMONY in his heart. Anyone who does not believe God has made him out to be a liar, because he has not believed the TESTIMONY God has given about his Son. And this is the TESTIMONY: God has given us eternal life and this life is in Son…” (1 Jn. 5:10-12, NIV). Jesus is the “faithful and true Witness” (Rev. 3:14). The Holy Spirit who inspired the prophets is the testimony (witness) of Jesus (Rev. 19:10).

    The whole law convicted Israel of sin (Rom. 3:20; 7:7). During the ministry of Jesus, even though Israel had the law they were no better of than the Gentiles who did not. Jesus said, “If I had not come and spoken to them, they would not be guilty of sin. Now, however, they have no excuse for their sin” (Jn. 15:22, NIV). The Holy Spirit now convicts the world in regard to guilt, sin, righteousness and judgement (Jn. 16:8-11).

    Moses said that the law “is not up in heaven, so that you have to ask, ‘Who will ascend into heaven to get it and proclaim it to us so that we may obey it ?’ Nor is it beyond the sea, so that you have to ask, ‘Who will cross the sea to get it and proclaim it to us so that we may obey it?’ No, the word is very near you ; it is in your mouth and in your heart so that you may obey it” (Deut. 30:12-14, NIV). In quoting Moses, Paul now applied this theme of Scripture to allegience to Jesus through confession of the Gospel message; “..Do not say in your heart, ‘who will ascend into heaven ?’ (that is, to bring Christ down) or ‘who will descend into the deep ?” (that is to bring Christ up from the dead). But what does it say ? ‘The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart’ , that is, the word of faith we are proclaiming: That if you confess with your mouth, ‘Jesus is Lord’ and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead you will be saved…” (Rom. 10:6-9, NIV).

    God’s presence stayed at the DOOR of the “tent of meeting” as He gave His instructions to Moses the mediator of the Old Covenant (Exodus 33:8-11). The Christian is a “tent” in whom God’s Spirit dwells (2 Cor. 5:1-5). Jesus is the “door” (Jn. 10:9, KJV). Jesus stands at the “door” alone without the need of Moses (Rev. 3:20). “For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus…” (1 Tim. 2:5, NIV).

    It is not scriptural to add or subtract from the 613 laws given to Israel (Deut. 4:2). It is not scriptural to add or subtract from the teachings of Jesus (2 Jn. 9-11; Rev. 2:24,25; Gal. 1:6-9; Rev. 22:18,19).

    The Ark of the Covenant that was kept in the temple was the center of O.T. ethics. John however, used O.T. symbolism to show that Christ is the center of N.T. ethics; “Then God’s temple in heaven was opened, and within his temple was seen the ark of the covenant… …I did not see a temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple..” (Rev. 11:19; 21:22, NIV).

    In the Old Testament the Ten Commandments were spoken out aloud by God. In the New Testament, God the Father spoke out the last part of Deuteronomy 18:15 “…LISTEN TO HIM !” (Matt. 17:5; Mark 9:7; Luke 9:35), showing that it is now Jesus who a Christian follows, not the O.T.law containing the Ten Commandments. The O.T. witnesses, Moses and Elijah, symbols of the “law and the prophets” disappear and the disciples were left with no one except Jesus only (Mark 9:8; Matt.17:8), as He is the final authority who governs all that we should now do and believe, not the O.T. law.

    Scripture clearly shows that all of the law including the Ten Commandments and the Sabbath were SHADOWS to the reality of Jesus.

    Jesus is the end of the law (Rom.10:4), but He is also the end of Seventh Day Adventism. Its day are numbered. If it survives it will only be a religious social club where sound biblical study and the true seeking of God will not be encouraged.

    Mark Sheridan, Australia.


  112. Dear Mr.Ben

    It is a shame you do not belive in Rev. 14 any more.

    But I say what will you do when the 7 last paluges fall. Sir you have built upon the sand and have no shelter. God is not mocked.


  113. Pastor (?) McPhaull!
    Sorry to hear your story…there is something worse than your letter of resignation: people like you preach for three years the doctrine of a church that they don’t believe. Actually you are not the first pastor in this situation and you will not be the last. Judas had more than three years until he made the decision to betray Jesus…
    I promise to pray for you…and for all those who congratulate you.


  114. I question the motive of someone who wants to share their resignation as a minister of the gospel. Why is Adventism treated as if it is something to be escaped? God loves all of his children and his flock is in many pastures. All that God requires of us is that we live up to the light we have been shown.

    Your work, as well as mine, or any other Christian who claims to be leading others to Christ, will be judged in the light of eternal truth. May God go with you in your continued search for truth.


  115. 1. I have tried to find out if the bible mentions Saturday as the day of worship.

    2. SDA students refuse to take exams on Saturdays and claim we are to keep the day holy. I ask them whether they break any of the ten commandemnts apart from the one on sabbath. They repply that as human beings they cannot keep all the commandments all the time. As a lecturer, if they do not take my exam I do not set any special exam for them and they get zero.

    3. I was on a committee with one SDA lecturer. Because of the urgency of the project and the fact that we could not meet during the week, we planned to meet outside our campus for an assignment on a weekendd – Friday, Saturday and Sunday. He joined us on Sunday because of the sabbath. The rest of us were also bible believing christians but we had to forgo our church service in the morning, otherwise the work could not be finished on time. What is interesting is that we all received the same honororium for the work done! He cheeted isn’t it? This is also against the ten commandments!!


  116. You r lost friend. u missed a wonderful chance what God provided, offcourse u still have a chnace to confess to God and return to the original place, where u have got plain gospel. U will never get such a pure and plain gospel in any where else. Please return back to ur place. I do belive we r the remenant beliver.

    God bless u all


  117. MY BROTHER YOU HAVE DONE A BIG MISTAKE BY LIVING THE CHURCH PLEASE PRAY TO GOD


  118. Such a pity! Hope you see the light..God bless you


  119. Hi Bro. Ben:

    I am so glad that I am able to contact you by some means. I want to let you know that I love you abd bless you. I thank you so much for contacting me when I was hospitalized. You truly were ministering to one o fhte least of these my brethren. I do hope that we will be able to stay in contact in a more personal and private way. I am sure God is doing things with this blog which will have eternal consequences, but it is not my desire to add to the fray. We all must make a personal decision recognizing that each decision has eternal ramifications. A lot of good things have been said on the site and it is my prayer that many will be blessed. As you might guess, my belief is that the Holy Spirit has led me to the place where I feel that with integrity, love and dedication to our Savior, Christ Jesus, faithful scholarship, trust that God will not allow faithful followers to be deceived, and the desire to with the Lord, I am a member of the Seventh-day Adventist Church’s ordained ministry. For my communication style the blog does not fit, but I am willing to study God’s Word face-to-face with andyone. Looking back on my own walk with Christ, I can tell you that He can lead you through some strange places, places where others are unable to understand. Always remember Abraham and Mt. Moriah. Stay very close to Christ. He will do whatever work is necessary in our lives as long as we stay with Him and commit through the power of the Holy Spirit to immediate obedience to each revelation Christ gives. You are loved and if there is ever anything that I can do for you, Please let me know.

    Jim Merideth


  120. Hi,

    First off I just want to say that I do not live by what my church tells me to, but what the Word of God says. I do most definitely believe in the Gifts of the Holy Spirit and so does the church I go to.

    When it comes to prophesying I believe you get a Word from God, which will 100% come to pass and not contradict the Word of God, I do believe Ms. White had some problems with that. If you want to believe she was a true prophet, then be my guest, but please excuse me when I say I believe she is a false prophet or should I say I do not believe she has the Gift of prophecy. The Holy Spirit cannot lie my friend, He is the truth!

    There is absolutely nothing wrong keeping Gods Commandments, but it all depends why you are doing it, is it because you think if you keep His Commandments you will be saved?(big mistake) or because you love Him so much that you have a desire to please Him and so try to keep His commandments? It is written that if you love Him you will keep His Commandments.
    The only way we are Saved is by the Blood of Jesus Christ! Those who believe in Him will not perish! John 3:16

    It seems as if Adventists makes a bigger issue out of Sabbath than Jesus Christ, is that right? It does look as if SDA wants to make some difference between them and other churches who live for Jesus, why? We are suppose to be brothers in Christ! Build each others faith and not place doubt in the minds of the body of Christ!

    Mark 2:27-28
    27And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:
    28Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.

    Look, I do believe we should at least take one day in the week to rest and make it a day we can worship and praise our Lord, but you must understand that when you are a nurse or a doctor you sometimes have to work on the Sabbath, does that mean you are doomed? Noooooooo, Jesus also healed people on the Sabbath…….all I can say is that legalism has become a great problem among Christians, but we need to know that we do not live under the Law, but the Grace and Mercy of God, Yahweh!

    I bless you in Jesus name!


  121. Hello Edem,

    thank you for your response. I am well acquainted with SDA doctrine, perhaps now more than ever. I disagree with you regarding SDAs position on the covenants. Followimg is a statement taken from the 2003 Sabbath School Lesson, 3rd Quarter regarding the covenants.

    “It is clear. The New Covenant is not something much different from the Old Covenant made with Israel on Mt. Sinai. In fact, the problem with the Sinai covenant was not that it was old or outmoded. The problem istead is that it was broken.”

    This statement is absurd, unbiblical and makes of little importance the reason Jesus came, lived a perfect life, died and rose again. The Bible clearly states that the New Covenant will not be like the old, but SDAs say it isn’t much different. They also perpetuate the following falsehood from the same lesson:

    “That the Hebrew nation, as a whole, had been given the covenant promises is, of course, correct. Yet, it was not done in exclusion to anyone else. On the contrary — all, Jew or Gentile, were invited to partake of the promises, but they had to agree to enter into that covenant. It is certainly no different today.”

    According to the Bible, the Old Covenant was given to Israel ONLY!  Deut. 5:2-3 says:

    “The LORD our God made a covenant with us at Horeb. It was not with our fathers that the LORD made this covenant, but with us, with all of us who are alive here today.”

    Then Jeremiah 31:31-33 states:

     31 “The time is coming,” declares the LORD, “when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah. 32 It will not be like the covenant I made with their forefathers when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they broke my covenant, though I was a husband to them, ”  declares the LORD.

    The New Covenant is not like the Old Covenant. Each has a different promise, condition and sign. The Old Covenant’s promise was Canaan Land; its condition was obedience and its sign was the Sabbath (Remember the Sabbath day…). The New Covenant’s promise is eternal life; its condition is faith and it’s sign is the Lord’s Supper (This do in remembrance of Me).

    Following are just a few of the differences between the Old Covenant and New Covenant (OC and NC): The OC was the 1st Covenant; The NC was the 2nd Covenant. OC was not of faith; NC = Law of faith. OC entangles; NC makes free. OC a shadow; NC the reality. OC fulfilled; NC now in force. OC leaves imperfect; NC makes perfect. OC out of Levi; NC out of Judah. OC made to change; NC made eternal. OC under law; NC under grace. OC no salvation; NC eternal salvation. OC a good covenant; NC a better covenant. OC for Israel only; NC for all men.

    Secondly, the Ten Commandments are not central to both covenants. In fact, the Bible plainly says that the Ten Commandments are the words of the covenant (the Old Covenant). Exodus 34:28 says, “Moses was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights without eating bread or drinking water. And he wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant–the Ten Commandments.”

    Deut. 4:13 says, “He declared to you his covenant, the Ten Commandments, which he commanded you to follow and then wrote them on two stone tablets.”

    The law consisted of the first 5 books of the Bible (Genesis – Deuteronomy) also known as the Torah (613 laws including the Ten Commandments). When Christ died, He fulfilled the law and the prophets. They were in essence nailed to the cross. When Christ died and rose again, He established a New Covenant and we, Gentiles, were invited to be included in this covenant because He tore down the wall that separated Jews and Gentiles. In fact, prior to Christ’s death, Gentiles did not have the law.

    Ephesians 2:11-13 says….

    11 Therefore, remember that formerly you who are Gentiles by birth and called “uncircumcised” by those who call themselves “the circumcision” (that done in the body by the hands of men)– 12 remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, excluded from citizenship in Israel and foreigners to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.

    The aforementioned texts prove that the law was not given to the Gentiles and that they were SEPARATE from Christ, EXCLUDED from citizenship in Israel and FOREIGNERS TO THE COVENANTS. By the blood of Christ they were brought near. This also disproves the SDA teaching that Gentiles could be part of the Old Covenant if they only accepted the terms. The Old Covenant was a contract with God and Israel only.

    Just as there were commandments for the Old Covenant, there are commandments for the New. The Torah was done away with at the cross of which the Ten Commandments were a part. The Torah was an indivisible unit of law that could not be separated. However, Adventists have held on to the Ten Commandments and my belief is because it contains the Sabbath. I am providing you with a link to all of the commandments in the Torah (613 commands)or Old Covenant and all of the commandments in the New Covenant (1050 commans). Under the New Covenant, you will not find a command to keep the Sabbath, but you will find the other nine commandments of the Ten. See
    http://www.puritan-books.com/books/pdf/new_testament_commands.pdf

    So a New Covenant Christian who steals violates Ephesians 4:28 not Exodus 20:15 and the New Covenant Christian who dishonors his parents violates Ephesians 6:2 not Exodus 20:12, etc. One of the mistakes SDAs make in the New Testament is translating laws and commands as the Ten Commandments. That is not always the case.

    For a list of the Old Covenant laws see:
    http://www.jewfaq.org/613.htm

    The SDAs are Old Covenant Christians. They say they are saved by grace through faith but they are still trying to work their way in via Sabbath keeping, etc. Going to church on a Saturday is available to whosoever will, it’s not a sin. However, to go because it’s a condition for salvation makes Christ death in vain. They say that they go on the 7th day out of their love for God because it is the special day He set aside for them to honor Him as Creator. Well, firstly, He gave the day to the Israelites only and secondly, He did not ask New Covenant Christians to keep a special day. Jesus is our Sabbath rest. He invites us to “Come unto Me all ye that labor and are heavily laden and I will give you rest….”

    It bothers me that when you leave the SDA church, people deem us as lost and lawless. That is so not the case. There are standards for holy living all through the New Testament but for me the best part is that the Holy Spirit gets to lead me personally. I don’t have to be a cookie-cutter Christian trying to live up to the dictates of the church and some of its unbiblical traditions and talked about or judged because I don’t conform. I’m free to love God, love others and give in the manner that is impressed on my heart by the Holy Spirit.

    I refute the statement taken from “Testimonies for the Church,” Vol.111, p.492 where Mrs. White says, “I have been shown that no man’s judgment should be surrendered to the judgment of any one man. But when the judgment of the General Conference, which is the highest authority that God has upon the earth, is exercised, private independence and private judgment must not be maintained but surrendered.” (In the book, “Testimonies for the Church,” Vol IX, pp. 260-261, the same author refers to “the voice of the General Conference” as “the voice of God”)

    The Bible teaches that “God … hath in these last days spoken unto us by His Son”; that the Father, Himself, has instructed: “Hear ye Him.” It teaches that God gave His Son to be “the Head over all things to the Church”; that Christ is the head of the Church:… that in all things He might have preeminence.”
    See Heb. 1:1-2; Matt. 17:5; Eph. 1:22; Col. 1:18.

    I believe that the reason there is so much confusion in the SDA church is because of deliberate deceit and the teaching that they (SDAs) are numbered with Israel. The above and following excerpt is taken from a booklet written by E. B. Jones entitled, “40 Bible-Supported Reasons Why You Should Not Be A SDA”. This is reason 24: The SDAs Teach that They, as a Denomination Are “Numbered with Israel” … “the Representatives of Heaven that Make Up the True Church of Christ”!

    In the book, “Ministry of Healing,” p 405 (edition of 1909), Mrs. White says: “We (or SDAs) are numbered with Israel. All the instruction given to the Israelites of old …, all the promises of blessings through obedience, are for us.” And in the book, Prophets and Kings,: p.74 (edition 1917), Mrs. White says: “wherein they (Israel of old) were weak, even to the point of failure, the Israel of God today (that is, the SDAs), the representatives of heaven that make up the true church of Christ, must be strong; for upon them devolves the task of finishing the work that has been comitted to man, and of ushering in the day of final awards.”

    The Bible teaches that (1) Israel, the natural ‘seed of Abraham,’ and the Church, the Spirit-begotten ‘body of Christ,” are wholly distinct from the other; ….. When SDAs and other religions take huge portions of Scripture that was intended indisputably and exclusively for Jews both in meaning and application and place it upon themselves, claiming to be Israel, appropriating to themselves Jewish promises and Jewish hopes; and would put the consciences of Christians under the bondage of Old Covenant legalism, they are doing Satan’s work and making Christ’s death in vain.

    I hope that you too will search the Scriptures to see whether these things are so.

    Be blessed,

    Pat


  122. Edem,
    Let me start by sharing with you an excerpt from an email I received from a Rabbi regarding the law (Torah or Old Covenant). I asked the question, “I understand that the Torah consists of 613 laws including the Ten Commandments. Are the 613 commandments considered a unit or are there categories like civil, moral and ceremonial laws? When Scripture speaks of The Law, is it speaking of the entire law (Torah)? Can the Ten Commandments be separated from the Torah?

    His response: “You ask if the Aseres Hadibros (Ten Statements) stand alone away from the Torah, away from the 613? No, they do not. They are a reflection of G-d’s complete law to the Jewish people. …. G-d’s covenants to the Jews and to the rest of humankind are all encompassing modes of daily behavior. What needs to be clearly understood is that G-d’s laws to the Jewish people are NOT the same as G-d’s laws to everyone else, and a person is to learn and follow HIS set of laws, be they Jewish or Noachide. He is not to become confused and think he is to follow the other person’s rules.”

    The Bible clearly affirms the Rabbi’s statement when it tells us that the law was given to the Israelites. I figured since the law was given to the Jews, a Jew should be able to give me the answer. The following statement is taken from The New Strong’s Expanded Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible, “…while the Mosiac Law is actually divisible into the ceremonial and the moral, no such distinction is made or even assumed in Scripture.” P. 172 (Greek Dictionary of the New Testament)

    Edem, you and I will probably never agree so perhaps we should agree to disagree. I will attempt to answer your questions, but I would like to begin this discussion by asking you to show me from the Bible where it states that the Ten Commandments are God’s moral laws. Show me from the Bible that they are God’s eternal, moral laws. Show me from the Bible where they were separated from the 613 and only 603 were nailed to the cross. I’ve spoken with SDAs and their position is that the distinction was made when the Ten were written by the finger of God and were placed INSIDE the Ark of the Covenant and the Book of the Law (aka Moses book or law) was placed beside the Ark.

    The reason the Ten were placed inside the Ark of the Covenant is because the Ten was the covenant. I shared Scripture in an earlier email to prove this point. God spoke to Moses and gave him the other laws and Moses hand wrote them in a book. SDAs say this book is what was nailed to the cross because it contained the instructions for the tabernacle, sacrificial system, etc. That statement is absolutely correct but what seems to be missing in their interpretation is the fact that the Book of the Law was the Torah, which was Genesis – Deuteronomy, which means the Ten Commandments was included in the Book of the Law TWICE ( in Exodus 20 and Deut. 5). Show me from the Bible where only part of the Book of the Law was nailed to the cross. Show me from the Bible where it says that “the Ten Commandments which stand fast forever are written on our hearts.” The Torah (the law including the Ten Commandments) was not to stand fast forever. It had a definite beginning and end. It began at Mt. Sinai and ended when the Seed (Christ) came. Galatians 3:19 reads, “What, then, was the purpose of the law? It was added because of transgressions UNTIL the Seed to whom the promise referred had come.

    I agree with your point #1. The Old Covenant pointed towards Christ and the New Covenant was its fulfillment. Christ became our sacrifice.
    Point #2: You asked me to explain Heb. 8:10 , which reads, “This is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel after that time, declares the Lord. I will put my laws in their minds and write them on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.”

    The NIV study Bible explains it thusly, Notes for 8:8-12
    “This passage is a quotation of Jeremiah 31:31-34, which compares the new covenant with the old. The old covenant was the covenant of law between God and Israel. The new and better way is the covenant of grace — Christ’s offer to forgive our sins and bring us to God through his sacrificial death. This covenant is new in extent — it goes beyond Israel and Judah to include all the Gentile nations. It is new in application because it is written on our hearts and in our minds. It offers a new way to forgiveness, not through animal sacrifice but through faith.”
    —Life Application Bible Notes

    If you recall, before the law was given (430 years after Abraham), God spoke directly to Adam/ Eve, Noah, Enoch, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, etc. and through visions/dreams.

    The word ‘laws’ in the above text is not referencing the Mosiac Law which included the Ten Commandments. ‘Law’ as used here comes from the Greek word nomos. Nomos in the New Testament is used for ‘law’ in general. The absence of the article before nomos (the law) indicates the assertion of a principle. “Law’ as used in the Torah, including the Ten Commandments comes from the Hebrew word towrah or torah meaning, the Decalogue of Pentateuch (Genesis-Deuteronomy). The Torah was never referred to as ‘laws’(plural) because it was one unit. If you break one, you break all.

    Your Point #3: “…We (SDAs) believe Christ is still in the tabernacle making atonement for our sins.” The assurance that the blood of Christ shed on the Cross of Calvary, made a COMPLETE ATONEMENT was the firm conviction of every New Testament writer. Hear the Apostle Paul express it in Romans 5:8-11, “But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Much more then, being NOW justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. 11 And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have NOW received the atonement.”

    Again in 2 Tim.4:6-8, we find that Paul was not hoping to pass the Investigative Judgment at some distant future time, for he knew all his guilt was washed away in the flow from Calvary’s Hill. There was no doubt about his future state in relationship to God. He had met Christ on the way to Damascus; he had accepted the sacrifice that was made for him. He believed on the Lord Jesus so fully that his testimony was, “For I am now ready to be offered, and the time of my departure is at hand. 7 I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith: 8 Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.

    When Jesus said, “It is Finished” He meant just that. Paul no where spoke of a long drawn out Investigative Judgment such as Mrs. White spoke of when she wrote, “The judgment is now passing in the sanctuary above. Forty years has this work been in progress…..” Spirit of Prophecy, vol. 4, pg. 315, pub. 1884.

    Your Point #4: I am not interested in what the SDA believes, only what the Bible says. You are trying to prove the similarities in the Old and New Covenant and in doing so you have provided proof texts to show otherwise. You said, I quote, “The Bible does not say God made an entirely new covenant.” According to the dictionary, ‘new’ means, ‘fresh; original and of a kind not seen before.” It was not upgraded, renewed or revised, the Bible plainly says NEW!

    Hebrews 8:13 (MSG), “By coming up with a new plan, a new covenant between God and his people, God put the old plan on the shelf. And there it stays, gathering dust.” The NIV says, “By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.” If the first covenant is obsolete, it is no longer in force. New means ‘new’.

    You also stated. “If the Old Covenant was made with Israel alone, then the New is made with Israel alone too.” Not true! God is God and He can do what He wants, when He wants, how He wants and through whom He wants. Our thoughts are not His thoughts and our ways are not His ways.

    It might surprise you to know that God reveals things in His own timing and He sometimes does it in stages. For example, Ephesians 1:5-6 (NIV) says, “he predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will– 6 to the praise of his glorious grace, which he has freely given us in the One he loves.

    The NIV notes says: Notes for 1:5
    “Predestined” means marked out beforehand. This is another way of saying that salvation is God’s work and not our own doing. In his infinite love, God has adopted us as his own children. Through Jesus’ sacrifice, he has brought us into his family and made us heirs along with Jesus (Romans 8:17).
    —Life Application Bible Notes

    Ephesians 3:6
    This mystery is that through the gospel the Gentiles are heirs together with Israel, members together of one body, and sharers together in the promise in Christ Jesus.

    Notes for 3:5,6
    God’s plan was hidden from previous generations, not because God wanted to keep something from his people, but because he would reveal it to everyone in his perfect timing. God planned to have Jews and Gentiles comprise one body, the church. It was known in the Old Testament that the Gentiles would receive salvation (Isaiah 49:6); but it was never revealed in the Old Testament that all Gentile and Jewish believers would become equal in the body of Christ. Yet this equality was accomplished when Jesus destroyed the “dividing wall” and created the “one new man” (Eph 2:14,15).
    —Life Application Bible Notes

    Matthew 10:5,6 says, “5 These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: “Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans. 6 Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel.”

    As you can see, Jesus had an appointed time to extend an invitation to the Gentiles as a people. When He died and rose again, the gospel was to be preached to everyone.

    You attempted to prove that the Old Covenant was for Jews and Gentiles. You cited texts such as Exo. 12:48 (KJV), “And when a stranger shall sojourn with thee, and will keep the passover to the LORD, let all his males be circumcised, and then let him come near and keep it; and he shall be as one that is born in the land: for no uncircumcised person shall eat thereof.”

    The dictionary says that a stranger is, “A person coming from another country or into a new community; alien, foreigner, newcomer.”

    I concur that Gentiles living among the Israelites had to be circumcised, etc. However, that does not inherently mean that the Old Covenant was made with the Gentiles as a people – only with those living among them. Look at it this way, when someone makes his/her abode in your home, they have to abide by your rules whether they like them or not. The Gentile strangers were living among the Israelites and God required that they become like them in order to approach Him. This does not mean that Israel’s promises were extended to them as a people, nor were they to reap Israel’s inheritance as you suggested. When the people reached the Promised Land, the inheritance was spread only among the twelve tribes of Israel. Even though they lived among the Israelites, they were still called and considered strangers.
    Romans 2:14-15 says …. 14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15 since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.)

    Perhaps you are unaware that there are more than two covenants in the Bible. Yes, Abraham was saved by faith. Under the Covenant God made with him, the promise was a son and a multitude that he could not number; the condition of this promise being fulfilled was faith and the sign of this covenant was circumcision. So yes, Abraham and others were saved by faith. With Moses, the condition was obedience to God’s commands (Abraham didn’t have the law, it came 430 years after him). When the Israelites received the law, they said, all that the Lord says, we will do (obedience). In faith, they looked forward to the Messiah’s coming but they had to obey. There were consequences for disobedience.

    We Christians are Abraham’s seed because like him, the condition is faith. Abraham didn’t have a written law, but God spoke to him and Abraham believed and obeyed God. The law was nailed to the cross and with the Spirit’s control and help, we live under the Royal Law of Love, which gives us liberty to freely love God and others.

    You are correct, no one has been or will be saved by works but the condition of the Old Covenant with Israel was obedience. Exodus 34: 10-11 reads, 10 Then the LORD said: “I am making a covenant with you. Before all your people I will do wonders never before done in any nation in all the world. The people you live among will see how awesome is the work that I, the LORD, will do for you. 11 Obey what I command you today. I will drive out before you the Amorites, Canaanites, Hittites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites.”

    Not I, but God said, “Obey what I command you…” Deut. 7:11-14 reads, “Therefore, take care to follow the commands, decrees and laws I give you today. 12 If you pay attention to these laws and are careful to follow them, then the LORD your God will keep his covenant of love with you, as he swore to your forefathers. 13 He will love you and bless you and increase your numbers. He will bless the fruit of your womb, the crops of your land–your grain, new wine and oil–the calves of your herds and the lambs of your flocks in the land that he swore to your forefathers to give you. 14 You will be blessed more than any other people; none of your men or women will be childless, nor any of your livestock without young.”

    God is a loving, kind, compassionate and faithful God. He sent His Son to do for them that which they were incapable of doing for themselves. He came as a Jew, lived as a Jew, was subject to Jewish law and kept it perfectly. When He died, the law and the prophets were fulfilled.

    Edem, I can only give you what the Bible says. In all of my 50 years of being Adventist, I missed these key points. I have to take the blame because even though I came into the church as a child, I believed what I was taught because it came from the Bible. Little did I know that SDAs are selective in Scripture and they rely on Ellen White for interpretation, which is why they love the Clear Word Bible. When I finally took the time to study for myself without the aid of Ellen White’s interpretation, the veil was lifted from my eyes.

    Some of your statements to me have really been abrasive and you have inferred a lot that I did not say, but I’ll chalk it up to miscommunications. You asked if I consider myself a saint and you quoted Rev. 14:12 as the definition of a saint, “….. Here are they that keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.”

    Commandments in this verse comes from the Greek word ‘entole’ and simply means ‘an injunction or authoritative prescription.” Note, too, that references to keeping God’s law in the book of Revelation always refer to the New Covenant laws not Old Covenant laws. So when John writes about keeping God’s commandments he means keeping the New Covenant commandments not the Old Covenant Ten Commandments. I provided a link in previous email.

    Yes, I am a saint, by the blood of Jesus Christ. It has nothing to do about my ‘doing’ but it has everything to do about my ‘being’ in relationship with Him 24/7. He did the work and I rest securely in Him.

    I pray you will have an open mind as you study His Word. For further enlightenment, I invite you to read an article entitled, The Faulty Covenant of the 7th day Adventist Church.
    http://esoriano.wordpress.com/2007/07/05/the-faulty-covenant-of-the-seventh-day-adventist-church/

    Be blessed,

    Pat


  123. We are more than saints in Christ, we are kings and priests! ;) Rev 5:10


  124. Edem,

    I respectfully refuse to dialogue with you further. I am convinced that you are not interested in truth. All you do is verbally attack me, twist what I say and render me ignorant of the English language.

    I have given you hours of my time trying to respond to you in a respectful and Christlike manner. I don’t have time for this foolishness. You don’t answer the questions I pose but continue to go off on tangents. When you are serious, I am available.

    My sincere prayers are with you.


  125. Yes I believe you will always sin, but will be able to overcome it through Christ who strengthens us, if you can’t overcome it, sin will dominate a person’s life and they will be a slave to it, struggling forever to overcome it on their own strength.

    To say you are living in the new Covenant, but live according to the old makes you cancell both Covenants. Can’t you see that? :(

    I wish you the best my friend!


  126. Do you really think for one moment that Jesus Christ came to setup a church named SDA, Mormon, Catholic, Protestant, etc.?

    He came to bring us the Truth of the Kingdom of God which will set us free from all bondage! I am a member of the Church of Christ, the Bride, I am a lover of Jesus Christ who died on the Cross for our sin, He who never committed one sin, He who healed the sick, casted out demons, brought the death to life and is now sitting on the right hand of God Abba, Father!

    If you are saying that you accept the Word of God above your beloved E.G White, then you must seriously look at it closer before you make such outrageous statements about her….

    Isaiah 26:4 Trust in the LORD forever, for the LORD, the LORD, is the Rock eternal.

    The Rock upon which the Church is founded is Jesus Christ not E.G White, Joseph Smith, Muhammad, Buddha, etc.

    If you are so upsessed with the Law, you will always feel guilty if you trangress, while the new Covenant sets us free from condemnation!

    It is written, if you Love Him you will obey His Commanments which are placed in our hearts, it does not say if you Love Him you will do better in upholding or maybe try harder to uphold His Commandments! So what is the hidden secret here, YOU MUST LOVE THY LORD JESUS CHRIST and all else will be added onto you and you will automaticcaly obey His Commandments! It is not about us, it is all about Christ Jesus our Lord and Saviour! He already paid for our sins at the Cross, no more payment is needed from us as long as we believe in the Holy Son of God!

    Shalom!

    The sooner you get that the sooner you will see the Truth!


  127. Who’s blog is this Edem? Do you have a right to be here? The pastor came to you in private and what do you do? try to embarrass him in public, you are evil minded my friend and does not seem to be led by the Holy Spirit.

    Talk about fruit…….what type of fruit do you think your action was? joy, longsuffering, goodness, meakness, loving, etc.


  128. Hebrews 10:16-17


  129. Romans 6:14 Is it not exciting!



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